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A Farbrengen. Illustration photo only, this photograph has no connection to the article.

Opinion: A Sem Girls Plea to her Former Principal

A negative experience one Seminary student had with a particular teacher left a deep and resonating negative impact. Compounding the problem was her principal, with whom she shared her concerns to no avail. Now, she shares a letter – a plea – she wrote for the sake of the next sem girl.

Dear Mrs. […],

I hope all is well with you.

I am sure you remember that I did not have a good year at seminary.

I think I had expressed to you, or at least tried to, that the lack of Middos of one of the teachers was extremely upsetting to me. In the end, I walked out of one of his Farbrengens in which he spoke about ‘shooting’ someone. I remember you followed me out and wanted me to look past it. I also stopped going to his classes at the end of the year.

It was baffling to me that all the staff and almost all of the students were so amazed by his brilliance that his rudeness was completely overlooked and condoned. It disturbed me to the point that today I am still struggling with feelings of resentment.

If it’s okay and even looked up to to be rude and teach chassidus at the same time, I’m not so sure I want a part of that.

In short, his lack of mentchlichkeit has greatly affected me and the way I am living my life now.

And in the end – it was I who was proven right. In the end, good middos prevail over how smart one is. Someone who is a mensch would never hurt his family like that.

But no one listened to me. And no one listened to me when I said the focus should have been on Ahavas Yisroel instead of how many Sichos you could learn a week . I remember sitting in your office and you were trying to revise the hachona for me but you were still making it too hard for me no matter what I said. That feeling of being totally misunderstood and being pushed into something impacts me till this very day.

You can ask my high school principle and he will tell you that before my year in Seminary, I was very chassidish and running programs. Today, I am far from it.

I am writing you this letter as a plea, when girls in Seminary come to you for help, LISTEN to them, try to understand them, do not push them until they won’t want to do it anymore. If an environment is emotionally threatening to someone, they will not want to be frum/chassidish anymore.

The only teacher who was SO respectful of the girls only taught once a week, unlike the other one who taught three times a week and always Farbrenged for us. That is Rabbi  C. who is an outstanding example of a true mensch. I wish he would have taught more because that is the one positive experience I had in sem, although so limited.

I turn to you not to spite, not to prove I was right. I just want that one girl who is sensitive like me shouldn’t get broken and hurt like I did. I just want one girl who will come to your sem to feel accepted just as she is and not forced into the cookie cutter mindset.

I want there to be a change in the focus of Seminary. Instead of pressuring girls into learning 5 maamarim a week, emphasize good middos, more chesed and talk to the teachers about being a role model of Ahavas Yisroel. Someone who is verbally abusive should not be allowed to teach!

Thank you for taking the time to read this.

A Hurt Sem Girl

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65 Comments

  • well written

    I think there should be an age limit to male teacher is girl seminaries. Older, wiser, and chissidisher men. Not young vibrant ones who hardly know boundaries!

  • an adult

    Enough with blaming every teacher you once had in the past for all your current issues.
    It’s one thing if he abused you.
    But if you didn’t like what he said: just stand up and leave! No one can force you , as an adult , to do anything.
    Grow up already and take responsibility for yourself.
    Stop blaming him for “how I now live my life “

    • Teacher

      Agreed. By now, you should have grown up; it’s time to take responsibility for your own actions & stop blaming a lousy teacher. Instead, prove him wrong & do what you know is right.

      Or are you looking for a convenient scapegoat on whom to blame your less than stellar behavior?

  • great letter..

    and its on crownheights.info because??????
    Dont fool yourselves.
    The world doesn’t need to read this.

  • Zack

    Ch.info is not the right address for your letter, and your sending it is totally inappropriate.

    • Crazy

      Your comment, is, in short, CRAZY. That three words that you put together “seminary is garbage”—THAT, is CRAZY. Do you know how many girls, go to sem, full of questions, and return a totally frum, chassidish, amazing girl, a true gem?!

      Now, maybe you had a bad experience, even a terrible one. But that does NOT give you the right to bad-mouth all sems. You can say “_____ seminary is bad” and you can even say what you did say, that seminary is garbage, but a pessimist like you, will not get very far. Maybe seminary was not the thing for you, but if someone who is wavering between going to sem or going straight to university, if a girl reads your comment, do you think that will make her want to go?

      There are great seminaries out there, and then there are not-so-great ones. Its your choice to decide where to go.

      (And, by the way, I am assuming you DID go to seminary, and if you didn’t, I dont know why I even bothered to reply!)

  • Upset

    If this is a personal letter and quite specific as well, It should not be posted on the web!!

  • Poor kid.

    I realize that you were hurt by disappointing leadership but this letter is immature. Don’t blame seminary for your lack of frumkeit or self-control. Yes, Middos should be emphasized, but this is the one year that we are allowed to indulged in real learning and that should be focused on as well. We are all responsible for our choices.

  • bubbygitel

    You may dislike the messenger,but honey,do not throw away the message! How many times have I heard not frum people say I left yiddishkeit because. Of a mean rebbe..let’s face it that’s just an excuse a rationalization to do what u want to. If you’re serious about your yiddishkeit,work hard find a mashpia whom you admire re middos,etc. Yiddishkeit wasn’t meant to be handed to u on a platter..run after emess,and u will surely find it!

  • I have been saying for years...

    that sem should not be about intense learning, it should be about preparation for the future, middos, yiras shomayim, becoming a wife/mother, shlichus, etc. (not talking about sem’s who are teaching training seminaries, but all the others)

    • Mix of both

      You have a valid point but some girls think “This is my last chance to seriously sit and learn, I want it to be worthwhile”. Thats why, if a girl, who wants to spend the last year of her life able to learn, wants to learn, she may go to a more studious seminary whereas a girl who is more looking to “have fun” may go to a more chilled sem.

  • How dare you

    i know exactly where youre referring to and you have taken that rabbi totally out of context…hes a known joker and he constantly warns that you need to learn to get used to him…just because you have an issue with somebody. doesnt mean you ride them off completely for everyone else

  • Anonymous

    I don’t know this young woman or rabbi or the school involved but it seems those of you who disagree are the ones missing the point. She says she is sensitive and others might be also so if this Rabbi wants to joke around do it somewhere else.

  • surprised

    personal issues should be addressed privately,evenif you have a point.
    besides it is a terutz-yiddishkeit is between you and the aibershter,and I am quite sure that you know that.if there was abuse involved, I would get it,but so what if you dont like his style or found the demands too much?maybe you were in the wrong place ,but there is no reason for not beeing as you know you ahould be.Please,please please

  • Smart

    If there was abuse you would understand?!
    Emotional Abuse is abuse and is also extremely damaging!

  • See nothing, do nothing

    Why should personal issues be sddressed elsewhere? These kinds of issues are the ones that are actually important not the fluff. Of course many would rather continue to stick their heads in the sand while the field around them spreads with fire.

  • I have to comment...

    Dear all.
    -Point well made
    -Hurt sem girl; That you are not chasidish anymore is not their fault, but these things for sure do not help to form a solid chasidisher girl/boy.
    -Rabbi B was/is not a good sem Rabbi.
    -Sem waist of money!
    -CH.info thanks for posting, very important

  • Yossi A

    To # 4
    When child molestation came to light people also said WE DON”T HAVCE TO PUBLISIZE IT
    How wrong they all were…..

  • please, please, please

    for everybody’s benefit- please refrain from writing names in the comments

  • the point is

    to the principal not to the teacher. the author wanted the principal to be more selective and alert when there are complaints about a teacher.
    FACT is that nowadays more then ever before, young children get turned off when there is emotional abuse from role models so if principal wants his schoold to produce chassideshe chevra/akerea bayis he gotta be selective and on the look out.
    but yes that one sentence can be left out otherwise the letter is good and again the author is not to blame it is crownheights.info that should decide if this is appropriate .

  • to # 12

    You say this teacher was a “known joker” and he said “people just have to get used to him”. There’s a fine line between students having to take a teacher with a grain of salt, and a teacher having to take responsibility for the way he/she talks. To have an attitude of “This is how I am, too bad on anyone who doesn’t like my style”, is haughty, and immature. Adults are responsible for their tone in speaking!

  • This could have been written by me

    I read this letter and was dumbfounded. I was a student at the same seminary and my experience was identical to yours, if not far worse. It was probably the worst year of my life and it took a while to recover from the experience. This letter does belong here. Maybe someone will finally get it! Kudos to you for speaking your mind.

  • really?!

    the author is making a mountain out of mole hill! really?! grow up! You’re not a little kid anymore. You’re an adult. Am i religious? NO. was i religious? yes. Did i live in ch? yes. but it has nothing to do with people talking a certain way. honestly, Children grow up being spoken to MUCH worse by their parents, teachers, etc. Just grow up and stop being so immature about it, who cares what he said…its YOUR life. live it how you seem appropriate!.

  • Don't shoot the messanger

    If you haven’t been in this kind of situation, you are in no place to judge this girl. An experience like this can ruin a person. Seminary is a time that girls are still growing and building a religious foundation. Isn’t that why we send girls to seminary!?!?! Feeling rejected and degraded by the people you are trying to please is a horrible feeling in any stage of life, how much more so at a vulnerable time when you are on your own in a new country trying to redefine yourself amongst new peers and teachers. If a person doesn’t have a strong support system to help them work through it, a negative experience like this can be extremely destructive. You can blame each of the many individual girls affected by negative seminary experiences, or you can break it down to truest common denominator. If the problem is happening with so many girls, but originating in the same place, maybe its NOT their fault. Let’s stop being so afraid of “the system” and save the girls who are falling through the cracks. Let’s call a spade a spade and see seminary for the farce it has become. Save yourself $20,000 and stay religious at the same time.

  • perfection

    there are abusive teachers in all of our schools,especially the yeshivas. they are not professionals they know next to nothing about chinuch or children, but they need a job,so we get stuck with them and our children suffer,these people are selfish arrogant and useless, they should be put out to pasture,may g-d have mercy on us .

  • sem girl

    To how dare you:

    wow. what can i say. you must be proud of being emotionally abusive just like this rabbi.
    i hope youre proud of yourself for causing others such pain and resentment. hey, hows it like having your head in the sand ;) ???

  • sem girl

    to an adult:
    stand up and leave????

    wow that really doesnt sound like the Rebbes all inclusive approach.

    Besides, the author said she didnt go to his classes.
    But here she can finally stick up for herself and STOP TAKING TH EMOTIONAL ABUSE from this teacher and other “unaware” sem girls alike!

  • sem girl

    to 27:

    wow im so sorry for you that your parents were emotionally abusive. mine were not so i would also have been shocked at the way this teacher spoke.
    im shocked that you consider emotional abuse as a “molehill”. i would NOT want to be your child.
    Get help for yourself and fast!

  • equalizer

    just look at the rabbonim,their childish fights etc the high school principals literally gangsters,oisforfs what do you think our kids could learn fromthem ,nothing .

  • to sensitive girls out there

    If you are on the sensitive side, I would recommend you thinking twice or a few times about going to this seminary. I had no emotional support there, although i tried reaching out, to the hanhala. But they were only interested in my spiritual advancement, not if i felt taken care of or socially comfortable. You will be in a new country without family to support you if you do not find friends or find a mentor in this sem. Its extremely scary to be in this situation. I would not say sem was the cause, but it was definitely the trigger of my later social anxiety. And yes, there should be place for sensitive people in these seminaries. The Rebbe included everyone, no rejection.

  • this 'rabbi'

    definitely did cause an outrageous damage. but to get weaker cuz of him is no excuse. roll your eyes and move on forward.if your personality is so dependant on how others treat you, youll fall deeper and deeper. strengthen yourself and strive higher.

  • Anonymous

    If you are on the sensitive side, I would recommend you thinking twice or a few times about going to this seminary. I had no emotional support there, although i tried reaching out, to the hanhala. But they were only interested in my spiritual advancement, not if i felt taken care of or socially comfortable. You will be in a new country without family to support you if you do not find friends or find a mentor in this sem. Its extremely scary to be in this situation. I would not say sem was the cause, but it was definitely the trigger of my later social anxiety. And yes, there should be place for sensitive people in these seminaries. The Rebbe included everyone, no rejection.

    • Social who

      None of these individuals running seminaries and yeshivas have any social development training. They seem to think everything will just work out like it always has or hasn’t.

  • way back when

    30 years ago when i was in sem some of my teachers/honhola were wonderful and some….well not so much. . i recently saw morah…….. at an out of town event where i now live and she felt the need to humiliate me in front of a room full of women,as if i were still 18. i just don’t get what these people think chasidus means.

  • A Concerned Parent

    Just because a man can open a book and learn, doesn’t qualify him to be a Seminary Teacher. Jews have always valued book learning, but with today’s lack of Middos Tovos, having menchlich, sensitive and warm and caring staff is just as important, if not MORE important, than men who can open a book and learn. I also think there should be more women in these seminaries, it’s not the place for a guy to work.

  • Enough!

    Girl, your blaming someone else for your issue. If you know it was wrong and even sat down to write this post, then why would it effect you? The real story is that you wrote this to assuage your guilt. You are blaming someone else for your problems and found a convenient way. Grow up! Life will be quite rough if you always try blaming someone for your issues.

  • why was this written

    some things are better kept to one’s self. writing this is wholly inappropriate. we’re not your audience. if you have something to say, say it to the principal. and about the other comments above, if you can’t bear the heat, stay out of the kitchen…

    • Cat got your tongue

      I do not know who this article is referring too. Cat’s not quite out of the bag. But I would like too. Not because of the individual but because I do not want to send my daughter there even with the “unknown” person not there. The administration of the seminary are equally to blame.

  • why'd you let the cat outa the bag?

    things were just fine the way they’ve been discussed over the past few weeks, in a subtle manner where “issues” were discussed as apposed to “people”
    . why do you have to make such a confrontation and make private issues public? everyone knows what you’re talking about. why the need to smear people online?

  • dumbfounded

    Why are there male teachers for seminary? I poshut never understood this.
    If my advice you will heed, you will go to a seminary with women teachers. As it says in the Heilikeh Rashi, Avraham was mikarev the men, and Sarah the women.
    Wishing you only success, mazal, simcha, and nachas.

  • perfection

    men should not teach in seminarys, too many stories, why put people to be tested , we do have women who are capable to teach,let them ,we will have less divorces,teach anger management , it would help us out.

  • midos tovos

    there are teachers right here in our midst kan tzivoh hashem es habrocho who insult girls and do not realize what an impact they make for the rest of the girls highschool years. ahavas yisroel let us stress ahava however talmud torah kneged koolom.

  • sem = amazing experience???

    So funny how this is the experience that all the girls are driving their parents crazy about!!!!!

  • author

    I want to apologize for that one sentence. I thought it wouldn’t be included but Im sorry it was. My main point was stressing the importance of creating an emotionally healthy environment which any mature self aware adult will agree with is essential at any stage in life.
    I did want to share that point with the public to warn sensitive girls out there about this seminary which had a strong impact on me. I am not blaming anyone for my problems, I am pointing out how certain teachers triggered resentment towards yiddishkeit in me. That is not blaming, rather it is expecting the basic middos in our teachers.
    Thank you and please be mature and civil in your comments

  • please stop blaming others

    you need to take a bit more responsibility for yourself
    and no matter how many periods a week a male teacher teaches you, they probably should not be “always” farbrenging with you.
    You also seem to be very into the “I was right” factor and “I was this” and “I used to be that”
    Your letter should be sent to the director of the sem, not placed here
    If you want something online-in such a public fashion-you should have written about the general idea you are trying to share, not about specific people that hurt you or how “you are right” at the end

  • Anonymous

    I think you are all missing the point. When you are in an administrative position in a school ,yeshiva or seminary you are resoonsible for each student. If they come to you with concerns regardless of whether you feel they are justified YOU MUST LISTEN!! Validating their concerns allows for a trusting relationship to develop. At that point you can then explore and help the student deal with their concerns. Most of the damage is done when the student feels that no one cares or hears them. I have been in the classroom for over 40 years with teenagers. All they really want is to be heard and their fears and concerns validated and then they will copperate to help deal with issues.

  • with the old breed

    what lubavitch needs is 300 shueml Moonkus. If that does not solve the problem at least we will all get some good stories.

  • Walk it off!

    B”H you are wise enough to realize whats right and whats wrong. So get past and realize you didnt connect well with one rabbi and that he shouldnt effect your connection with the rebbe and hashem! obviously you were happier before sem, so it shouldn’t be to hard to get back into things. The rabbi could be a bad guy but it has nothing to do with your yiddishkeit.

  • why ;blame the author

    the author is not the one who chooses to make this public so stop blaming her. it is this website that can alter and edit this letter to make it public appropriate.

    Again the message here is for the principal or director to hire staff who know how to inspire sincerely.the author is not blaming the teacher as much as the authorities.

  • don't let it get to you!

    I haven’t graduated yet and maybe our principal doesn’t know ,but when a respected adult says something ”like what you think doesn’t really matter!” ,that helps me to understand that if I ever go into education i will listen to my students and make them understand that what they think is important !I have no respect for this lady though i stand up for her some one who thinks that they have the right to say that should not be education.When my principle name is mentioned i think play ground bully.Then again my other principle i aspire to be like!

  • To the author

    The story you conjured up in your head is based on wide spread rumor. Believe half of what you see and none of what you hear. This Rabbi is entitled to the benefit of the doubt. If what (may or may not have) transpired was a private issue, why does he need to be attacked in public? Let’s leave his issues to him, his family, and whoever else is actually involved. As far as the issue of having male teachers in a seminary, that’s a good point. But that doesn’t seem to be the point addressed in your article. That point was addressed already in another and it’s now an old discussion. If you wanted to change something, instead of writing this silly article, you might petition the seminaries.

  • To the Author:

    In seminary I felt the same way as you. I did not understand why everyone was so inspired by this Rabbi who displayed no respect for his students or fellow Chassidim. I was confused by my own friends who were blinded by his intelligence and didn’t flinch when he would say the most uncalled for comments about people or to students. I was more disturbed by the smart girls who liked him and even repeated what he said to bring out a point. My survival method was to be mentally absent while in his class, yet I still came out affected. My parents didn’t have anything to tell me, they wanted to know why the principle wasn’t doing anything about it. I am still baffled as to how 54 girls can be so silent and meek (myself included) when a Rabbi can say something so below the belt. Let this be a lesson to all that as mind blowing someone’s intelligence may seem, it is the way he treats the people around him that defines who he is. And teachers must learn from this that students (yes, smart ones too) are watching their middos and believe it or not, this will affect how much they learn. And hanhalos should learn that even if the offender may be mishpocha to the employer, his middos and actions should still be scrutinized as any employee’s would.