85 Comments

• rebbe decried drinking

  Rebbe said mashke is disgusting and made a huge decree

• Sruly C

  The drinking must end, a little Lcahim is way more then enough.

  Shuls have to advocate that the focus of the Kidush is Achdus Nugunim and sitting together in unity, if the Mashke stays in the liquor store that’s also fine.

• hate crime!?????

  this is insane. all of a sudden the police rush to charge with a hate crime, all the while the real hate crimes go un-noticed

  • Intoxicated

    Off-duty cop. If you are intoxicated the last thing you want to do is have an argument with a police officer even an off duty one. The police protect their own.

• ouch

  Its out of control. Married men in tallesim being assisted home drunk late afternoon… I’m sure your wife kids are proud of you not! And sitting in central booking in the best of time ain’t petty. Good luck!

• To 3

  Welcome to your vadd hakal for mast 20 years or so

• mendy

  BH
  BSD

  AND SOMEONE CAN MAKE SURE….THE DRUNKARD ALLEGED SHOMREI TORAH AND MITVOS..AND REPRESENTATIVES OF JEWS AND LUBAVITCH…CAN HOME SAFELY..AND NOTVJUST HAVE THEM LEAVE

• Comment 3

  They have a person claiming that racial slurs were said. They are looking into it. When community members were attacked they also tagged it a hate crime. Otherwise these two guys were rowdy in 770 down through kingston and with their irresponsibility could’ve brought a calamity on this community especially days before the big parade…

• Common sense

  Don’t argue with a police officer.

• to num 4

  How can you be so mean about this you should be ashamed of your self imagine how they are feeling now the are already upset they are sitting now in jail have some ahavas israel you dont know what situation they were in and why they were drunk!!!! And who said they are married men in tallesim get your facts rite they are 20 years old if you know how to read . ok

  • there is NO excuse

    sorry # 10. These bochrim BROKE THE LAW by underage drinking. Broke the Rebbe’s takana by drinking. And made a massive hillul Hashem.
    And the married men in taleisim – these are not the same guys as the 2 bochrim. But you see them way too often.
    Guys, grow up. If you have problems get help, AA, a mashpia or mental health professional. Just don’t get drunk and disgrace everyone in the community.

    Yes, I have rachmonus on these bochrim, rachmonus that no one properly educated them to behave with derech eretz. And rachmonus that they were forced into hillul shabbos.
    But who is so irresponsible to provide all the mashke they imbibed? Shame, shame on you too. You too are responsible for this disgrace.

    This should be a warning to all other men, especially those supported by our tuition dollars. You can only drink if you are old enough and responsible enough to stay sober.

    Once they are released they should be kicked out of our yeshivas, together with any other boys who behave so terribly.
    I hope they are released soon, and sent back to serve in the IDF where maybe they will learn how to obey the law.

• L'Chaim

  If you drink like a בהמה (animal) then you will be one when you have one too many.

  If you drink like a Nefesh Elokise, meaning you hear a good word by a Farbrangen that really touches you and you say l’chaim then you should be o.k. (of course you must still stay within the limits that the Rebbe has put in to place).

  One sin brings to another…One Mitzva brings to another…

  Sometimes you do something that you don’t know if it was the right thing to do or not.
  When will you find out?
  If later you do something that you really know to be a sin or Mitzva without a doubt.

  Another thing:
  There is never an excuse to throw food, hit somebody/slap, destroy property, and scream in the streets like a maniac (even if it’s a Chassidic niggun) etc… all in the name of getting drunk by a farbrengen. If you can’t Halt Cup (hold your head) don’t drink! (say l’chaim on water).

• Jew

  Keep blaming the drinking instead of looking in the mirror.
  Racism, explicit or implicit, is still a big problem in the Lubavitch, and frum community in general. Time to move on.

  • Milhouse

    Why is it a problem? Since when is it an aveira to be racist? (It’s a narishkeit, and perhaps violates the Tanya’s injunction ואל יהיה שוטה, but there are many statements by Chazal and the Rishonim that by today’s standards are frankly racist. We may have more information than they did, but we are not wiser, and certainly not better than them.)

  • K

    Milhouse, do you R”L believe that you “have more information than they [Chazal] did”???

  • Milhouse

    Yes, we certainly have more information than Chazal did. Many things have been discovered since their day.

    For instance, we know that the “bottom half of the world”, i.e. the area between Europe and Asia, is not one huge ocean; they had no idea that America exists. We also know what infection is, how to prevent it, and how to cure it. We know what causes earthquakes, thunder and lightning, shooting stars and comets. And we know from personal experience what people of all races are like, and don’t have to rely on outlandish reports or tiny and unrepresentative samples, as they did.

  • K

    Pure kfirah and zilzul of Chazal. Donkeys like us claim to “have more information” than malochim of the “rishonim”.

• I agree with 3

  How can this be a hate crime if they guy approached them first? The real hate crimes get swept under the rug. A hate crime is when someone targets someone else out of hate not when someone uses slurs at some point in the middle of a heated argument.

  • Milhouse

    Hatred is not a crime at all. Using slurs is not a crime. A “hate crime” means an ordinary, everyday crime that happens to have been motivated by hatred for a whole group of people. Assaulting someone is a crime, no matter why you did it; assaulting someone because he is black, white, Jewish, goyish, straight, gay, Israel, French, or whatever, is a hate crime. That doesn’t make it more of a crime, it just means the sentence is likely to be stricter.

    In this case, the man had every right to approach them and tell them to be quiet. They had no right to assault him for it. If they assaulted him it was a crime. If they assaulted him because he was black, then it was a hate crime. If they assaulted him only because he was telling them off, and they would have done the same to a white person who tried to tell them off, then it wasn’t a hate crime, even if they used racial slurs.

    But how will a jury determine their motive? Jurors are not mindreaders. If there were slurs uttered in the heat of the moment, that doesn’t prove that the assault was motivated by racism, but it may indicate it, and the jurors may (perhaps incorrectly) understand it that way.

  • awacs

    “But how will a jury determine their motive? Jurors are not mindreaders.”

    And jurors, by definition, are people dumb enough not to get out of jury duty. And, Brooklyn is at least a third Black, and the juries I’ve seen are often all-Black. Good luck for a White defendant accused of slugging a Black victim.

  • Milhouse

    And jurors, by definition, are people dumb enough not to get out of jury duty.

    With that attitude, that will always be the case. If you want smarter and better juries, start by not trying to avoid jury duty, and by encouraging others to do the same.

• Jo

  A little young, a little foolish…what were they thinking? My guess is because they are on foot and not driving, they felt safe drinking excessively. It’s unfortunate the rabbis will now have to monitor and limit the l’chaim! Very sad for all involved and I hope this doesn’t escalate into a hate crime but remains what it is – a couple of boys with too much liquor sloshing around inside of them.

• Oy Gevald...

  ..not again!!!

  2006: http://crownheights.info/general/1694/bochur-arrested-for-drunk-disorderly-conduct-in-public/

  2007:http://crownheights.info/crown-heights-news/9692/bochur-wandering-semi-dressed-in-front-of-770/

  2008: http://crownheights.info/crime/13844/israeli-bochur-arrested-after-punching-cop-in-the-face/

  2008: http://crownheights.info/crime/14116/83-year-old-man-shoved-down-stairs-in-770/

  2010: http://crownheights.info/crown-heights-news/29078/fire-accident-intoxes-and-arrests-over-yom-tov/

• anti semites

  They arrest these bochurim with excessive charges and do nothing to the goyim involved

  • Milhouse

    Why do you think the charges were excessive? Perhaps they were, I don’t know, but do you?

    And why should they have arrested the gentleman who told them to be quiet? Is there any indication that he committed a crime?

• TO #1

  If you’re going to quote the Rebbe please be accurate. The Rebbe never said mashke is disgusting. If he thought it was he would not have drunk it himself and certainly would not give it out by the bottle to various shluchim etc. What he did say was that people under the age of forty should not drink more than three or four l’chiam’s which is not from an eight ounce cup but from a little shot glass. I was at more than one Purim farbrengen and saw the Rebbe down several glasses of mashke in honor of the occasion. The people in charge of these bochurim must put down rules and keep an eye on the bochurim as well. This is not only damaging for the community but causes a huge chilul Hashem.

  • Milhouse

    The Rebbe actually did say that משקה איז א דבר מאוס. That doesn’t mean not to drink it. One should drink it, but only because it has a good effect when used properly, not because one likes it. And when one drinks it לשם שמים, reluctantly but with קבלת עול, then it will not have bad effects.

    The Rebbe also said (and I heard this myself) that mashke is like מי מעין, which are מטהר במשהו, and the four cups is a maximum, not a minimum.

  • K

    Milhouse, if משקה איז א דבר מאוס then pray tell how does one make a bracha on it? איסור בל תשקצו!!

  • Milhouse

    K, לא עלינו תלונותיכם. The Rebbe said it, and the Rebbe made a brocho on it.

  • K

    This is the perfect example that EXPRESSIONS cannot be taken out of context. Often such expressions are NOT literal. If indeed משקה איז א דבר מאוס in a literal sense, then it would be forbidden to make a bracha on it! It would certainly be ossur to make kiddush on it (I am talking about kiddush on a 1 oz shot glass – as is the accepted minhag in klal yisroel because that is the “normal” amount that is consumed).

• ITS OUTRAGES

  how many times have Jews been attacked for no reason, other then being Jewish,and in many instance anti Semitic slurs where used, yet their was no hate crime charges brought against the perpetrators(not to mention letting the attacker go).
  yet when the one charged is a Jew the Police are very quick to use hate crime charges.
  as Jews we have to speak up and not let this pass.

  • Moshe

    Hahahahahaha. This is probably the first time I’ve ever heard of Jews being charged with a hate crime, so who are you kidding?

• Cajun Chosid

  if the israeli bochurim are tzefati’s then this arrest can be a good way to send them back home and rid CH of some of these Chillul Hashemniks.

  But I doubt that would happen.

  Some of our are so good ” at turning the other cheek”
  that we don’t even see when we are being taking advantage of and spit on.

  Smoke out the tzefatis and liberate CH from their craziness so people can come to 770 and feel like they are in the Rebbe’s shul and not some loony bin.

  Do we need George W to set CH free?

• Send them back!!

  Send them back too where they came from. This behavior has to stop

  • Who?

    Who do you want sent back?

• disappointed

  While the incident &their conduct is deplorable keep in mind white on black MN yc thete will be hate crime charges levied in my opinion 2 More importantly where are the lawyers I do believe they have to be arigned within a certain time by law yes or no?Talk of holding them until Tuesday is a violation of their rights!There’s a need to focus here or are thein the community going to side with the alleged victim as usual?They’re excellent at siding with criminals etc. Against their victims especially when the victims are young teenagers & the mother is a convicted & admitted to the crime soy guess in this vase for pc they will side with the Goy Especially if the Bachurim are Kvutza Bachurim who are of course evil &have the chutzpah to say Yechi & hold the Rebbe is Chsy V’kayem etc. After all The Rebbe’s own eords are supposed to be just that to those that just want to be liked popular etc.

  • Milhouse

    Please translate that into English. I have a vague idea of what you meant, but it’s too difficult to figure out exactly what you wrote.

• These boys are not bochurim

  They are not frum Israeli teenagers that were drunk , the one who gave them mashke is responsible for the chilul Hashem

• Moishi

  Amazing that there is an ad on this website for discount beer and alcohol.
  Unfortunately this is ruining the lives of many families and young bochrim.
  The Rabbonim must make a stance .

  • Milhouse

    What’s wrong with discount beer and alcohol? Alcohol is a good thing. It is Hashem’s gift to us, and (as Ben Franklin said) is a sign that Hashem loves us. But it’s such a powerful gift that it has to be used wisely. As the Alter Rebbe wrote in the haggadah, we have to use the power of binah to remove the aspect of anger that is contained within it, and direct that toward the kelipos, so that what remains is סוד יין המשמח.

• Garden of Yearning

  May they immediately be released and cleared of all charges! On another note, I hope my fellow Lubavitchers will consider reading the book “the Garden of Yearning,” and pay close attention to the chapter on light drugs/alcohol and cigarettes. I see way too many of my precious, helig Lubavitch brethren smoking and using the excuse, “the Freidiker Rebbe did it.” The Alter Rebbe said that the body does not belong to us to harm in any way. Please be careful!!!!! Your health is very important to me, and the Rebbe, shlita….

  • Why?

    Why should they be immediately released and cleared of all charges? If they are guilty of a hate crime, then let the courts do what they are designed to do.

    People are fallible. Hate crimes are not exclusive to one group or race.

    There are many groups that live in crown heights and we all need to respect each other. No one is above the law and no one is better than his brethren.

• Savta

  Wherever alcohol is served the hosts bear the responsibility for their guests. This applies to Shul Kiddushes, Shabbos and Yom Tov l’Chaims, Brisim, Bar/Bat Mitzvahs, Engagement/Vort Parties, Weddings, etc. Alcohol consumption should not be condoned.

  Drunkenness is a big Chillul Hashem. It is a Health and Safety issue as proven in this article.
  Belligerence is uncalled for under any circumstances. Alcohol consumption is bad for the body, mind, and soul.
  What would the community say if this person jaywalked and r’l got hit by a car? Whose fault would that be? You can’t blame alcohol – blame the person who abuses the use of alcohol. They need to face the consequences of their actions.

  • Milhouse

    Alcohol consumption is not bad for the body, mind, or soul. On the contrary, it is good for all three, and it should definitely be condoned. The Torah, Chazal, and chassidishe tradition are all unanimous in support of consuming alcohol, but in moderation. Use it, don’t abuse it.

    And since only an individual himself can judge how much he should drink, if he overdoes it it’s his fault, not his host’s. The host doesn’t know how much the guest can handle, and shouldn’t be a policeman to monitor it.

• Oy

  Perhaps noted addiction counselor Rabbi Dr. Shais Taub can organize an event to help correct this growing problem in CH and other communities.

  • not enough is being done

    How about he also adresses the drug & gambling problem here? They aren’t confined to idiotic youth, there are serious problems with married guys betting their homes on the turn of a poker card or online betting.

  • Bochur

    exactly what would u like him to do?

• when mashpia

  When mashpia walks home drunk , this is a bad example for bochurim if he can’t walk home in a straight line , he did not follow the Rebbes instructions , what a bad example for our precious bochurim , the yeshivah hanholoh should enforce the code , no drinking at farbrengens , including alcohol addicted mashpiim , this drinking is dangerous to today’s youth , it poised to make drunkards from innocent boys .
  The boys who were arrested were from Israel visiting , they were not frum yeshiva boys . Clean shaven teen agers . Stop mashke now . Nobody is in the level of old Russian chassidishe level to take mashke

• emes

  Those who lived on the block and saw the chilul hashem know exactly just ask them.

• Kiddish af vayseh

  Who ever makes Kiddish on vodka is חוטא ומחטא עס הרבים this klipah in our community must stop
  Gaboim in 770 must shut down the Kiddish table they are allowing a Kiddish club in the daled Amos of the rebbe, this hefkerus must be stopped at all costs , youngerlait walking around drunk is opposite what the Rebbe stands for and taught us , this is not Lubavitch , this is sitra achar same group talks during Krias hatoras

• Mashke

  to #17
  אני שמעתי את הרבי אומר בהתוועדות “משקה איז א דבר המאוס”

• Zalman the Shikur

  “IF YOU GET DRUNK FROM MASHKE YOU ARE NOT SAYING LECHAIM AND/OR DRINKING LIKE A CHOSID”……..

• anie

  I feel so bad for the Borchim, that they have to stay in jail till Tuesday, it is not the best place to be, I am sure when they are sober they are going to relize what they did

• Depends

  If these Bochrim were Chassidish Bochrim, and after a full day of Farbrangen became elevated in their Avodas Hashem, to daven and learn better – then granted.

  However, if theses two Bochrim are stam Pusta Keilim, just drinking booze – then let them be arrested

• Ma Rabbi

  regardless of the circumstances, 2 frum Jews are in jail and all the resources of the community must be used to get them out. This is a Mitzvah of Pidyon Shevuyim which takes presidence over other Mitzvohs.

• Bar mitzvah

  I was at a beautiful bar mitzvah in empire shtieble last winter. No mashkeh was served every table had one bottle of wine. We need to accept that a simcha can be made with no mashke. The goyishe bars and bar drinks that our children see at weddings and bar mitzvahs is not the lichaim our dear Rebbe was permitting. Please let us have dry kidushim in shul on shabbos however sweet with the words of chasidus.

• Fresser Rebbe

  the details of how THIS case will work out, hate crime or not, etc. etc. is one thing.

  however, the problem with the drinking is one that if we as a community dont stop this, it will only get worse, much worse.

  we must tell the younger generation that its not that drinking is really a good thing, a chasidishe thing and so on, but because that not everyone can handle it, so we should stay away, no no and no again, it must be made clear that according to any true authority that counts, starting with the Rebbe, משקה is bad בגשמיות and ברוחניות, with no advantage at all, and the so called משפיעים who drink like drunken sailors and watch their students (our children) drink are going against everything that Yidishkait and Chasidishkait stands for.

  much more, and many more details will follow in a future article, in closing, my opinion is that an orgenised campaign must be started NOW to get each and every chabad מוסד to fire the משפיעים that are quote Alchoholicks

  • Milhouse

    You wrote: according to any true authority that counts, starting with the Rebbe, משקה is bad בגשמיות and ברוחניות, with no advantage at all,

    That is an utter falsehood. שקר וכזב. Alcohol is good for the body, and good for the neshomo, and has many advantages, but only in moderation.

• K

  This isn’t the first time and it won’t be last.
  They get drunk rowdy and fight and when anybody tells them quiet down they attack. They live in my building i see this all the time. They need to learn respect or leave this neigberhood!

• AA in Yeshivah

  Besides Chassidus and Nigla, there hould be a manditory AA meeting (once a week) for every Bochur from ages 18 – 22!

  • Milhouse

    Are you nuts? Even according its own claims, AA is only for addicts, who, according to the AA ideology, cannot be cured, and can’t ever safely take even one drink without becoming drunk, so they must abstain for the rest of their lives. It is therefore definitely not appropriate for non-addicts, who can and should drink safely and responsibly.

    Even for addicts, this theory of AA has no scientific basis, it’s simply an ideological shita that someone dreamed up and convinced millions of gullible people of. Maybe by chance he hit on the truth, but there’s no reason to suppose so.

• YMSP

  So shocking and terribly sad how people can start with quotes about mashkeh on such a thread and as a reaction to such an occurrence, R”L.

  One thing is clear, with this and the Yitzi Shuchat BLUT BILBUL make it crystal clear how we as Jews should not ever, ever, ever engage in mesirah (aside from all the other reasons and the destruction that one does to their neshomo R”L). Any connection with the police should be done the same way as we keep darkei sholom with the government, just as the Rebbe did, at a distance and without complete tacit approval of them.

  As to the sad, mavhildiker comments… Mashkeh may well be a dovor hamo’us, but the comments on here make it (comparatively) as sweet as honey.

  There are 2 Jews in PRISON, Rachmonoh Litzlan, Hoyoh Loi Siheyeh! How many are saying TEHILLIM for 2 JEWS who are R”L in prison?

  Why would anyone want to speak ill at a time like this and not be moerer Rachamim on them? I have no idea who they are. But if anyone cares about the Rebbe or about the Aibershter then maybe they’ll take the Rebbe’s words to heart that the Aibershter cares about EVERY single Jew much, more more than parents care about their only child who was born to them in their old age. If you don’t like them, maybe do the Aibershter a favor and say Tehillim for His two only sons who are in PRISON R”L (and for R’ Sholom Mordechai HaLevi Ben Rivka while we’re at it and Yonasan Pollard and all the others who need help) and not say things that aren’t MeOreir Rachamim at this time.

  May they be freed. Ad Mosai?!

• to comment 49

  I agree that who ever can help them should to lessen the severity of their jail time. However this is not a blood libel, and for u to suggest that this is a blood libel is ludicrous! They were drunk and rowdy and assaulted an older man for no reason! Whether or not it was hate crime still needs to be determined and if there is no proof of it than community leaders have to insist those charges be dropped, but a crime was committed its called assault. Adam moo-ad leolam just because theywere inintoxicated doesn’t absolve them from anything. Besides the fact that such actions put the entire community at risk!

• Anonymous

  It is those that think it is macho or “chassidish” to make kiddush on mashke who are responsible.

  Those who instead of giving to tzedkaka must by $200 bottles of scotch every Shabbos and make kiddush on mashke.

  The youth and their children see them doing this and can’t wait until they are able to do this.

• jewish dude

  I hope somebody bails them out or at least visit them.
  Is the Embassy of Israel notified they usually have a list of lawyers they can contact, they will need them.
  Hope they are doing ok.

  • Ma Rabbi

    He makes a valid point.
    The Israeli embassy must be notified immediately. Which CH Askanim are taking care of the 2 boys?

  • Are you kidding?

    The Israeli embassy has better things to do than worry about two drunk people. If you think that it doesn’t, then you have a very poor idea of priorities.

  • Milhouse

    You mean the consulate, not the embassy. But no, the consulate does not have “better things to do than worry about two drunk people”. This is what consulates are for. There may not be much the consulate can do for them, but at least it can send someone to visit them and impress on the police that they should be treated carefully, because the Israeli government is paying attention.

• TIME FOR ACTION

  about 2 weeks a bochur was assaulted by three African American youth, in a knockout style attack,they were apprehended, but the cops let them go.
  i don’t understand why the community let the cops get away with such outrages decision.
  we should demonstrate get politician involved and not rest till these thugs are brought to justice.
  BUT when a Jew is charged they throw the book at him.

• not easy to change a mindset

  Chassidim always consumed mashke. Always made kiddush on mashke. Always said lots of lechayim. This is fact. To reinvent our behavior is no easy task. Even after the Rebbe’s decree, the behavior didn’t completely change.
  It will take a major effort on the part of rabbonim and mashpu’im to reeducate the community on this and enforce rules and ways to keep away from drinking.

• Cholent Mit Kugel

  Always a puddle of vomit on corner of Albany and Union, Shabbos afternoon…

• moishe

  The worst is when a male mashpia farbrengs in girls seminaries and aren’t ashamed and have the audacity to drink mashke during the farbrengen this is the worst of worst! do you get it why?
  there may be many ways to solve this by either have the maspia’s wife in attendance she will keep in tact or keep the mashke out of such gatherings, the best and most advisable keep the male mashpim from farbrenging with seminary girls! the married women educators can do a wonderful job to farbreng in the seminaries
  I’m writing this from feedback Ive received through many years from my many daughters in the lubavitcher top seminaries.

• to # 61

  agree to every word.
  I may add: what are men doing heading girl’s sems irrelevant how big a Chossid, hameivin yavin!
  They just don’t belong there, they may be great to raise funds but why the interaction?

• NOT CHABADNICKIM

  The two boys who were handcuffed and shoved into the police cars did not look like Chabadnikim. and did not act like Chabadnikim.
  I don’t know what they were doing in CH.
  When the Mashke goes in, the truth comes out. Young men from Chabad families, when they have been drinking, you do not see hostility come out.
  Even those who may have anger – the anger is not directed at the blacks in the hood.

• MISLEADING TITLE

  Because the word Bochurim is used in the title. Readers will picture boys in hats and jackets on Shabbos. It may be technically correct that Bochurim just means young men or unmarried men – but readers of CH.I are inclined to think of Chabad Bochurim.
  Hence the reactions in the comments.
  The boys arrested did not look like Chabad Bochurim. They looked like Israeli guys who happen to have poor taste in clothing who put small Kipas on their heads when they came to CH to make trouble.

• Levy

  The fact that only 2 and not 20 were drunk and causing problems is because of peer pressure. The fact that this is a rare occurrence is a testament to the beautiful moral and civil upbringing of the Jewish community at large. We should all be proud that these types of incidences are an aberration and not a daily event as in so many other societies.

• Fresser Rebbe

  בה

  Once again, in regards to the two boys, i hope that sll is being done to secure their releace… and so on.

  In regards to our problem with the משקה, i once asked my son how his Farbrengen went, hw tells me it was great, his Mashpiah, a real good yungerman and a Chasidishe as well, had his four L’chaims then went to the bathroom, then when he returned to the Farb. he said that according to הלכה he would need to make another ברכה now because of going to the bathroom, so then it is a new Farbrengen as well, so lets go ahead and have another four rounds of L’chaim.

  With out getting into the לומדות of this, the very idea that 15 year old בחורים are subjected to such garbage, and not from someone in the street rather from a מגיד שיעור that meant it with all his heart, tells me that this problem is very deep. this Farbrenger was younger then 30, so he is already the third genaration of the גזירה of the רבי against משקה, he didnt come up wirh this above לומדות, it was around in my ישבה days as well, so when the רבי was talking (screaming) writing, in public and in private that משקה is a no NO, and that even for the חסידים older then 40 קידוש should only be made on wine, and that who ever was planing of drinking משקה on תהלוכה should better not go, rather stay in CH, whaat do you think the רבי was talkingg about, do you think for a second that the רבי did not mean it for real, and if חס ושלום this is what your feelings are, is thisthe only one of the רבי’ס ענינים you have issue with or some other things aas well, and if there are more then maybe you shouldent be teaching our children. I couldent say that this משפיע should talk to HIS משפיע about this, becaus chances are that are that they were both cut from the same cloth.

  ok gotta go now…

  SOLUTIONS??!!?

• jewish dude

  The solution is: drink kosher grape juice that way you can not be drunk. And these charges are very serious. Any body who think not,public intoxication, assault and maybe a hate crime is not a parking ticket that you can take care of. These young man need our help before it is to late. To the Fresser Rebbe, frumme yidden can only be drunk on Purim and Simcha Torah. The solution for the rest of the year drink kosher grape juice.

  • Milhouse

    Grape juice is not יין המשמח. It is technically יין for the purpose of brochos, and technically one can be yotzei kiddush and havdalah and arba kosos with it (though the Rebbe seems to have disagreed), but it has none of the physical or spiritual benefits of wine, because those come davka from alcohol, in any form, including mashke.

  • awacs

    Wine is really ok. It’s very hard – unless you’re REALLY into alcohol – to get drunk on table wine. You get sick (yechh!) first.

  • Milhouse

    awacs, mashke is also OK, although it’s easy to get drunk on it; you just have to be careful not to. Most of the health benefits of wine come from the alcohol in it, and the same benefits can be got from mashke. But alcohol is healthy only in small doses. As the medrash about Noach and the seven animals says, the first few drinks are good for you, but the subsequent drinks are bad, and each one is worse than the previous one.

  • Haha!

    Milhouse,
    You mean ‘חמר מדינה’ NOT ‘יין המשמח’…… I crack up at every one of your replies but that one really got me!

• Zalmy

  I understand how they feel those two Bochurim should keep their mouth shut and they should mind their own business or maybe they drink a lot of alcohol by a LChaim

  • to # 72

    WHAT?

• wondering...

  how does the yeshiva that is known to produce a steady stream of alcoholics every year justify itself in the name of the Rebbe?
  always wondered….