Controversy Erupts Over Signs Asking for Tznius

A minor brouhaha is playing out in local media over signs that have been popping up around Crown Heights, asking “residents, guests and visitors” to dress modestly, as it is “a Jewish neighborhood.”

The signs were first reported by a blogger for The Gothamist, who took great offense from the seemingly innocuous and politely worded sign, calling it “demanding” and “pushy.”

On Sunday morning, a reporter for local news outlet Pix 11 walked up and down Kingston Ave. interviewing residents – both Jewish and non-Jewish – on their reactions to the signs.

The reactions varied slightly:

One Rabbi told PIX11 News he agrees with the signs.

“A woman should cover up, she doesn’t have to display what she’s got,” he said.

But on a hot summer afternoon a woman wearing a short skirt and halter top told PIX11 the Orthodox community should show tolerance and accept others for who they are especially when it is hot outside.

Elisheva Schwartz, who is Orthodox says she is offended by the signs.

“I think it is very important we don’t inflict our views on everyone.”

Schwartz said it’s the diversity that makes Brooklyn so great.

On a Facebook group populated by members of the Crown Heights Orthodox-Jewish community, a post about the signs received a wide and diverse array of responses from commenters.

“‘This is a Jewish Neighborhood’ is claiming ownership and exclusion to others; [is it] covered in the First Amendment?” wrote one critic. “It is discriminatory.”

Others commenters were critical as well:

“The issue with the signs, is that they do no good. It’s not as if anyone is going to change the way they dress because of a sign. Instead, it makes the entire community come off as self-absorbed and arrogant. Just read the comments.”

“These signs are offensive and rude in any neighborhood and they hurt the people more that have a nisyaon in tznius. It makes them, go more off. If the tznius cops worried about dressing like ladies and not like shlubs then young people would have who to look up to…. Those signs turn off the Machon Chana girls new to Yiddishkeit, the girls from Beis Rikva who are struggling and people like me who gets so frustrated with the word tznius bc I believe people should live it and not talk about it.”

On the other hand, several commenters outright supported the effort, while others said they had no problem with them at all:

“What could possibly be your problem with them asking people to dress modestly? I agree it is pointless and none of anyone’s business, but what is the possible negative impact of this sign? If anything this is a beautiful example of freedom to express themselves.”

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207 Comments

  • 1. Rivka wrote:

    The Rebbe writes that the most important thing for women is Tznius and the most important thing for men is the learning of Chassidus in public.
    We need not be ashamed of who we are.

    • 2. matson wrote:

      Then sign should say “To all Jews in the neighborhood – your Rebbe requests that all Jews dress modestly” But this sign is telling everyone ELSE how to dress. This is AMERICA. I have First Amendment RIGHTS. You dress how YOU want, and I’ll dress how I want. I don’t care if you are ashamed or not of who you are. Don’t tell ME how to behave. You don’t have that right in AMERICA.

    • 3. Ezra wrote:

      Wrong, Matson. We have the right under the First Amendment to put up such signs; you have the right to ignore them, but not to prevent us from exercising our freedom of speech.

      Perhaps you’d be more comfortable someplace like Cuba or North Korea, where the authorities will tell you what you are and aren’t allowed to say. But you don’t have that right in AMERICA.

    • 4. Sorry wrote:

      You do know it’s illegal to post on public property. People have a right to tear it down if they want to.

    • 5. to Madson wrote:

      Every jew has the mitzva of hocheach (meaning to make sure thay other ppl keep mitzvos) so it would s my buisness.

  • 6. Signs Don't work wrote:

    No one will change their views nor the way they dress over these signs.

    The only way to make changes is by teaching our own girls to have self respect.

    When the girls are being thrown out of school and or their moms humiliated in schools this does not teach them self respect nor allow them to respect what the teachers are teaching.

    In the meantime kudos for the group of people who have made yet another chilul hashem.

    • 7. Milhouse wrote:

      How is it a chilul haShem to stand up for the Torah? Whether you think it will help or not, by definition it CAN’T be a chilul haShem. On the contrary, this is exactly what kiddush haShem MEANS.

    • 8. CML wrote:

      very well said. no one is changing the way they dress because someone put a sign up. All you are doing is insulting people. Did it occur to whomever put up the sign that 60% of crown heights is exactly NOT jewish. It’s rude and insensitive to put up such a sign.
      Also, what happens when shluchim (who do this a lot in the summer) bring people from their chabad house? The young girls already feel uncomfortable in such a different setting why would you want to put up a sign that say HEY YOU WE SEE YOU AND WE DONT LIKE THE WAY YOU DRESS!

      Again, whomever put up the sign probably had good intentions but it was done properly. If you wanted to tell the Lubavitchers of crown heights (or people who will actually listen) write the sign in hebrew or yiddish. I personally don’t understand either but I would also ignore the sign regardless.

  • 9. SUCH A NICE ARTICLE... wrote:

    Finally some step of action to enhance the community’s standard of tznius. Why lament 9ver youre personall discomfort with being reminded of halacha?

  • 10. YMSP wrote:

    A) The fist din in Shulchan Aruch, central to Jewish life, Al Yisbayesh Mipnei Hamaligim.

    B) Israel is at war. The people who are its enemies call themselves the “leadership of the Pelishtim” and even though they are not leaders and their people are not Pelishtim, there’s still a horaah in avodas haodom that will help Israel win (a military victory was naturally impossible in 5708 and 5727 ’48 & ’67 and the Yom Kippur War was not much different). Pelishtim in Chassidus denotes a movoi hamefulash – an open main courtyard (area that connects courtyards) that’s open from all sides. If we defeat our movoi hamefulash, our mind that is open to all kinds of crazy, useless, ridiculous things, and we become Eretz Yisroel (as the Rebbe brings two Torah pisgamim/sayings together – Eretz – sherotzeso laasois retzon kono, Yisroel, ki soriso im Elokim vim anoshim vatuchal – the land that ran to do Hashem’s will and Yisroel as explained in Chumash, that wins anything for Hashem) in our own beings, and from that comes out a victory also in the world, just as our actions are a miniature of the world and affect the world at large.

  • 11. Sarale wrote:

    The tznius “cops” dont dress like shlubs, they dress tzniusly. And anyone who takes offense at a sign obviously has a problem with the area of tznius. A sign should be seen as a plea from people in the community who do not want to fall because of lack of tznius. The Rebbe himself emphasized the importance of improving tznius and how it even protects soldiers and yidden in Israel and all over. if a person is not yet on the right level, okay, no problem. But to openly fight against it and complain is not right either. Tznius is from the Torah. If a person is not not on a proper level spiritually yet and is still growing, fine. But at least respect where you are. you are in the Rebbe’s shikun. You are in a frum community. Respect that. To purposely parade up and down the streets dressed in a non modest fashion as if to say “accept this”, is also not right. what kind of example are you to others?? people have children to educate. Living in a frum community comes with responsibility.

    • 12. ???? wrote:

      Is Crown Heights still a “frum community”? It was once upon a time. Now it’s a place where rich yuppies from Chabad homes are clean shaven, their wives dress disgustingly & behaviors are more suited to the old Times Square. The signs are wrong but it’s a result of desperation by the few CHers who actually care about the schunah.

    • 13. Well said!! wrote:

      WHY are so many Jewish daughters tempted to dress so immodestly? Do they enjoy the feeling of flaunting themselves in public? Have they NO values? (oh, yes, THEY don’t speak loshen hara – yeah, right)
      If they don’t enjoy being among frum people, there is a WHOLE world of neighborhoods to live in. Why do they insist on trashing ours with their foreign values?

  • 14. I was Quoted But Not Named wrote:

    I am only posting here because I dont want to embarass my husband.

    My quote was taken here.
    I was the one who said the comment about the slubs.
    I dress tznius. 100% in confides of a halacha.
    I DO NOT LIVE IN Crown Heights. THe ladies who PREACH TZNIUS are the ladies who sheitals look like rats, whose kids are dirty, whose houses look like they need a SWAT team to clean.

    They wear SHMATTES that look like bags. SHOW ME A REBBETZIN that can relate to the young people?? SHOW ME. I WANT TO KNOW who inspires people who doesnt look like they need to updated. Tznius isnt about dressing in shamttes, Its about LOOKING LIKE A LADY. Thats YOUR CLOTHES ARE FROM THIS DECADE. That your sheital is WASHED and set. ThAT YOUR PANTYHOSE dont have runs from here until tomorrow and that they dont sag. Because thats who I SEE preaches tznius.

    I dont see someone put together, under age 40, with young kids, who is put together, has a good home life, works, and tries her best yelling about tznius. Oh, right. Because THOSE LADIES are at home, with their families, WHERE THEY BELONG. NOT preaching TZNIUS when the fact is, a) people visiting dont understand the sign isnt for them and neither do the new Machon Chana girls b) Its going to set FIRE to the people WHO HAVE PROBLEMS with tznius, NOT INSPIRE them, and c)DONT YOU DARE BRING THE THE REBBE INTO THIS, bc I am pretty sure the Rebbe spoke NOT TO DRESS LIKE A SHLUB to begin with!

    • 15. Milhouse wrote:

      I am pretty sure the Rebbe spoke NOT TO DRESS LIKE A SHLUB to begin with!

      Perhaps you can quote the sicha where he said that. Or do you think you can just make up whatever you like and say you’re “sure” the Rebbe said it? His sichos and letters about tznius are easy to find; he made no secret at all about where he stood on that.

    • 16. You sound quite upset wrote:

      Yes, there are frum ladies who dress like shlubs, but un-tznius ladies look like shlubs as well. They for SURE don’t look like Jewish daughters!
      Why do they think we’re interested in seeing practically their entire body with not much left to the imagination? It’s like those who blare their music – Who told you I’m interested in hearing ??!

    • 17. CML wrote:

      I am just saying the Rebbe went to a girls dormitory (i think the one on montgomery and kingston) and he looked around and told them to put up mirrors. The Rebbe wanted ppl to dress tzniusly not like a shlub. The only problem is it is very hard to dress tznius in the summer so people end up looking like a shlub. I am not saying its impossible I am just saying its hard.

    • 18. I'm so sorry for you, wrote:

      I’m sure you just totally mortified your dear Hubby!
      Where did you pick up that mouth?
      Oh yeah, my sheital does not look like a rat, I don’t dress like a shlub, And thank goodness I don’t have an attitude.
      This is the Rebbe’s community. He asked and begged us to dress and behave with tznius, and not to follow the styles dictated by “the goy in France”. Unlike yourself, lehavdil, who demands to know “who doesn’t look like they need to updated”. We don’t want to look like the low class women in their pathetic “updated” fashions. We want to look like proper Jewish women and girls. Not like anorexic fashion models.

  • 19. this sign is amazing wrote:

    everyone must cover up. no matter who is telling them
    the fact is that Hashem commanded this, so we MUST do it!!!
    no excuses!
    imodest dress should not be excepted in crown heights!

  • 21. Here's my thought wrote:

    Walk into most tznius womens clothing stores in our neighborhood and you will find it difficult to shop. Either spend a fortune to have everything you buy altered or deal with the styles that often sell by default because the customers shopping there don’t want to look nerdy, but there are very few choices in that category. I Demand! Let’s build up crown heights the way the rebbe would want it. He saw the huge bracha and potential here!! Make our clothing stores attractive, easy to shop in and women should get together and work with the designers of the clothes to create beautiful tznius affordable clothing. We need to be ready to greet moshiach! So start working on getting peoples talents together and then we can advertise our amazing dignified clothing. Once people fall in love with the new styles and fresh approach, it will spread like wildfire, then, who wouldn’t want to be tznius?

    • 22. Bravo wrote:

      How about a shop where every item is kosher?
      Long sleeve, collared or high-necked tops; A-line or pleated skirts that don’t hug the hips and are at least long enough to cover the knees even when sitting or getting out of a car!!!.
      Pretty everyday wear, formal shabbos wear, elegant chasuna outfits.
      Clothing that caters to the Jewish woman and girl, because there are dozens of places for everyone else to shop.
      We have many stores, but I have yet to see one that exclusively carries kosher clothing.

  • 23. Less Offensive More Inclusive wrote:

    Instead of writing it a Jewish neighborhood please dress tznius it should have said its an African-American neighborhood dress tzulozen. That would be more mult-cultural and more inclusive and no one would be offended.

  • 24. unnecessary wrote:

    Whether or not the sign is correct is irrelevant. We have to face the facts: this is not a fantasy world… no one seeing these signs will listen. All it’ll do is cause animosity and hatred towards us.
    I think everyone agrees women should dress modestly, but our definition of modesty is very different than theirs… You can’t expect them to bow down to our definition.
    If it was a Muslim community asking passersby’s to obey their laws of modesty and wear a hijab I think we would be no less outraged.

  • 25. VLM wrote:

    You live in a diverse neighborhood in a diverse city, and you do not own the streets or sidewalks in those neighborhoods. New Yorkers are free to dress as they like and go wherever they want. As an urban planner will tell you, if you don’t like that, exiting is always an option.

    • 26. Milhouse wrote:

      It’s a Jewish neighborhood — look around you and you can see that. And no, we’re not leaving. If you don’t like it, you leave. Nobody asked you to come here in the first place.

    • 28. Milhouse wrote:

      Ari, the whole world is ours. Why was the world created in the first place? Only for Am Yisroel. Why does anything in the world exist? Only to benefit Am Yisroel. “Even a ship sailing from France to Spain is only blessed becuase of Yisroel.” That’s fundamental; as a Jew you have to believe and accept that!

    • 29. Ari wrote:

      I don’t have to accept that. And I already know what your response will be of me. I refuse to think like a i’m in a herd.

    • 30. To #18 Ari wrote:

      He is giving over the Gemorrah. That is what it says. And it is fundamental as he says. Don’t accept it? Think about that.

  • 31. Moishe wrote:

    All of a sudden we are trying to emulate williamsberg and by the why the signs are for lubavitchers more then for guests

  • 32. Arieh wrote:

    IMHO, if schools have dress codes, I see no problem for streets and neighbourhoods to have dress codes.

  • 35. YMSP wrote:

    One other thing should be pointed out rather than the usual us against them thing that usually develops in these kind of discussions.

    We’re all in this together.

    Someone who doesn’t want to be tzinus really needs to ask themselves if their comfort or expressionism (on only the most outside level and doing a great disservice to who they are inside) is worth not protecting an Israeli soldier’s life. People who have a tendancy to look at not tznius also need to ask whether their lack of shmiras einayim is worth not protecting an Israeli soldier’s life.

    Shmiras einayim is connected to the foundation of our being Jews and the foundation of the most basic service. We all need to ask whether we are Jews in our essence (revealed essence, who we are as people – not talking about our etzem), or whether we can now become Jews in our essence even if only for the sake of Jewish soldiers and the people of Israel.

    Re being offended – no one should be offended when sincere people want to encourage and remind us of age old standards, for everyone’s benefit. Islamic terrorists who’ve shot little kids who don’t convert to their whatever-you-call-it, Hashem yishmor, should offend you. Save your being offended for say rabbis who pervent halacha for profit or politics offend me. Be offended at groups who falsely claim the mantle of halacha to promote its exact opposite, and demand (often unkosher) gittin-on-demand instead of encouraging people to save marriage. Don’t be offended by those who want to bring Hashem’s protection and blessings on our own lives and on achinu Bnai Yisroel hadorim baaretz, our brethren in the Land of Yisroel.

    • 36. Disgusting wrote:

      To blame women for soldiers in EY being injured or dying is: inaccurate at best, who are you? G-d? It is also demeaning of women, shifting the blame when G-d knows why things happen! Or are you Bilam? Who gives you the right to talk that way?

    • 37. Ezra wrote:

      Who’s blaming? But if we are pleading with Hashem to protect our soldiers, then it is only logical that we need to be doing what He asks of us.

      Besides, the Torah does draw this connection. See Devarim 23:15 (translation from http://bible.ort.org/books/pentd2.asp?ACTION=displaypage&BOOK=5&CHAPTER=23):

      “…G-d your L-rd makes his presence known in your camp, so as to deliver you and grant you victory over your enemy. Your camp must therefore be holy. Let Him not see anything lascivious [in plain language: untzniusdik] among you, and turn away from you.”

    • 38. YMSP wrote:

      My comments are to men and women equally/separately as anyone can clearly see.

      The fact that tzinus gives protection and one should give up their lack of it/lack of shmiras einayim in order to protect a soldier’s life is well sourced and was basically the Rebbe’s instruction at such a time.

      The connection between shmira and morality is a fact and sourced from Rashi (sof parshas Bilam incidentally) on.

  • 39. Milhouse wrote:

    Do you want to know who was a “tznius cop”? Rav Ada bar Ahava. When he saw a woman wearing a garment thta was not tzniusdik, he ripped it off her in the street. It turned out that she was not Jewish, and was able to sue him in court and he had to pay her a fortune for embarassing her, but the gemoro says that this was a kiddish haShem, that he was willing to take that risk for the sake of doing the right thing, and that laments that we don’t have that kind of mesirus nefesh. None of us, even none of the amoraim, would have the guts to do that, but he did, and we admire him for it. So what right does anyone have to complain about “tznius cops”? I bet those people complaining about these signs would also condemn him and call him a crazy fanatic.

    • 40. unnecessary wrote:

      As far as I recall, the gemara simply states when he realized she wasn’t Jewish he paid for the damage.
      I don’t recall it saying it was a kiddush Hashem or that he only paid because he was gonna get fined.
      assuming my recollection is correct the story would prove the opposite; that we have no business dealing with non Jews modesty.

    • 41. Milhouse wrote:

      Go learn the gemoroh again. What is the whole point of the story? It’s to explain why the older generation got rain when they need it and we (the generation of Abaye and Rovo) don’t. And the answer is that they had such mesirus nefesh and we don’t. They were ready to take such risks for Hashem, and we aren’t. In other words, they were better than we, and we should admire them.

      Since he did the right thing, why would he pay except that the court forced him?

      And of course this was a kidush haShem. What do you think Kidush haShem means?

    • 42. Ezra wrote:

      “unnecessary,” how about looking up the actual Gemara rather than relying on “as far as you recall”? The Gemara there clearly categorizes his actions as a kiddush Hashem (קמאי הוו קא מסרי נפשייהו אקדושת השם – “the earlier generations sacrificed themselves for kiddush Hashem”), and he was fined by the beis din (שיימוה – “they assessed [the damage]”) – but only because she was a non-Jew (אגלאי מילתא דכותית היא – “it turned out that she was a gentile”); had she been Jewish, she would have had no claim against him, because his actions were fully in keeping with halachah.

    • 43. Really? wrote:

      He saw that she wasn’t dressed in a “tznius” fashion, so he RIPPED HER CLOTHES OFF?…………in public no less…

    • 44. Milhouse wrote:

      Ezra, where does it say it was a beis din? I don’t believe a beis din would have fined him; on the contrary. But since she wasn’t Jewish she took him to a goyishe court, which fined him.

      To “Really?”: Yes, really. This is what the gemoro says, so you are not free to disagree with it.

    • 45. to Ezra wrote:

      True I should have checked up the gemara beforehand, however, i think you misunderstood my point.
      As far as I understand these signs were put up primarily for the non Jewish whites moving in to the community.
      My point was as follows: the gemara states when he found out she wasn’t Jewish he paid for the damage. The implication is, had he have known she wasn’t Jewish he wouldn’t have torn apart her garment.
      What i was trying to say is that this story would seem to imply that we have no business dealing with modesty of non Jews. Had it of been praiseworthy he wouldn’t have paid the damages.
      My comment was in reference to non Jews not Jews.

    • 46. to 32 wrote:

      The garment want tznius because of its flashy color not because it was revealing.

    • 47. Ezra wrote:

      Milhouse: fair enough, you’re right – Maharsha there says לפי ששמוה לה בדיני ישראל, that they assessed the fine according to Jewish law, implying that it was a non-Jewish court.

      “to Ezra”: I highly doubt these signs are addressed to the non-Jews (and why would it matter whether they’re “whites” or not?); they are addressed to our own people. And frankly, the “controversy that has erupted” over this shows that it’s hit a nerve.

  • 48. Chana wrote:

    I’m just glad the reporters didn’t notice the signs stating that it is a husband’s duty to supervise his wife’s clothing.
    How embarrassing.

    • 50. To #33 Chana wrote:

      Yes it is terribly embarrassing that it has to state a husband’s duty to supervise his wife’s clothing. It should be a given. The husbands in this community are an absolute disgrace. Wimps does not even get close. I would call them something else but it would not be very tznius. The husbands should be berated in the most harsh manner.

    • 51. Milhouse wrote:

      A husband certainly has a duty to instruct his wife when she is doing something wrong (just as a wife must instruct her husband when he is doing something wrong). But it’s a free country, and nobody can control what their spouses do. If the husband gives his opinion and the wife ignores him, what’s he supposed to do? Divorce her, ch”v?! In the end he just has to live with it. And if rebuking her will harm his sholom bayis it may be better that he should keep quiet and let other people tell her the truth, people who don’t then have to live with her.

    • 52. Chana wrote:

      Supervise? Excuse me? What year do you think we live in?
      Women are adults and responsible for our own behavior. We do not need the “supervision” of men telling us how to dress. If a husband wants to inspire his wife and work together on enhancing their yiddishkeit in a positive manner, that’s great. But a grown woman does not need supervision. Should we “supervise” our husband’s davening and learning habits?

    • 53. To #48 channa wrote:

      The whole issue IS about GROWN women. You thought it was about what? Babies? You appear to lack even normal sensibilities and intellect that even non Jews can have.For SURE your husband, if you have one, needs to supervise you and get help for you to think like a normal human, not like a child deprived of your childish ways and thoughts.

    • 54. to#49 wrote:

      There is nothing childish about her comments. You are very judgmental.

    • 55. To #50 wrote:

      Women are looking for supervision all the time. So are men and children.From mashpiim, rabbaniim, from writing to the Rebbe MHM, etc. If it were not a problem there would be no need for signs. The issue has been addressed for quite a while. The signs are a result of the need. There have been signs in C.H. for years about men not trimming their beards. In the 70’s, 80’s, 90’s, till now. No one made a big fuss about the signs, not men and not women. Yes the WOMEN are making the problem and the fuss, just like little CHILDREN. Very childish for sure. The men to weak to deal with it, so we get SIGNS.

    • 56. Chana wrote:

      Wow, that response was great. Provided me with my entertainment for the day! *rolling with laughter*
      I will make sure to let my husband know that he must supervise me so I can begin to think like a “normal human”.

    • 57. To #52 Chanale wrote:

      Good start. At least you are prepared to ask your husband to supervise you. Be sure to say please. We teach that to all the kinderlach. Rebbe MHM always says there are those that are like children even if their years are more than a little child. My grandchildren and great grandchildren also laugh and roll on the floor. Happy that you say that your husband MUST supervise you. That’s also positive, as everyone can recognize their foolish, childish ways. Today’s Tanya lesson. If your husband can’t help you, look to other means of help.

  • 58. Live and let live. wrote:

    You have no right to impose your Halachos on others, especially those that aren’t obligated to keep them. If you are worried about the “atmosphere” of the Shchuna, you, more than anyone, should know that this reflects a personal issue and cannot be resolved by controlling what others do. Stop blaming “outer” and start focusing on “inner” for once in your life as a Chossid. Start learning Chassidus and being honest with yourselves.

    • 60. Milhouse wrote:

      They’re not “our” halochos, they’re Hashem’s halochos, and they are binding on all people. Znus and pritzus are not permitted to anyone.

    • 61. "Binding on all people"? wrote:

      Last I heard, Tznius was not in the 7 Mitzvos Bnei Noach.

  • 62. why? wrote:

    Why are we Chabad copying Williamsburg and Satmar conduct….This is their way. It has never been ours…We have people from all walks of life and different levels of yiddishke coming here. We chabad accept ALL jews No matter their level of yiddishkeit. This is a way to enstrange jews from coming here….And coming here is their first step to accepting yiddishkeit….Did the Rebbe ever tell His secreteriat to hang up signs that only those dressed appropriately come and get dollars. NO Because this is not our way of bringing people closer. We unconditionally aceept and offer love and acceptance because you are a Jew .And we continue in a loving learning manner. Not with negative signs…Yes you do see those signs in Williamsburg..That is their way. Not ours. And no Bais RIvka chabad girl from CH will change her dress because of that sign. Get Real I am shocked that we Lubavitch dont see it this way…..The Rebbe’s way

    • 63. Thank you wrote:

      Thank you – finally a voice of reason.

      All of those who stand behind this sickness in the name of religion go against everything the Rebbe stood for! They are no different than the taliban, hamas and isis.

      A yid needs to have a relationship with Hashem first and foremost.

    • 64. To #38 wrote:

      You are right. Those girls are not going to change for any reason. And you don’t need a G-d or a Rebbe to recognize the need for tzniut. And for SURE you don’t need a TORAH to understand this. If He brought us to Har Sinai and did not give us the Torah, DAYEINU. A properly reared and educated Jew would understand this. Shame on you, your grandparents, parents, teachers, mashpiim, educators, and above all YOU.

  • 65. To No. 21 wrote:

    I read your story about the Amora…But i have lived here for 60 years and I cannot imagine our Rebb e doing that because He wouldnt….He is MY amora and I follow his path to bringing people closer….Acceptance and teaching and love….A sign shows nothing of that,,,It is the pathetic act of people with the “i am better than you” attitude..And that is NOT the real CHABAD

    • 66. to 32 wrote:

      The Rebbe actaully quoted this story at a farbrengen and said the lesson we can learn from it is when a person sees something which is the opposite of tznius he/she must protest.
      I don’t recall the source for this but I’m positive without a shadow of a doubt the Rebbe said this.

    • 67. Ezra wrote:

      Sicha of Pinchas 5710 (http://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=19858&pgnum=171), for one:

      התוקף בעניני תומ״צ צ״ל לא רק בהיותו בישיבה או בביהמ״ד,
      …אלא עליו לצאת לרחוב

      יכול מישהו לטעון שאין זה מדרך הנימוס לגשת לאדם שאינו
      מכירו, אינו יודע מה נעשה עמו, ואפילו אינו בטוח בעובדת היותו יהודי
      כיון שאין זה ניכר על פניו… והמענה לזה — שפיקוח נפש דוחה הכל,
      …וגם על הספק מפקחין עליו את הגל

      …וע״ד סיפור הגמרא ש״רב אדא בר אהבה שיימוה בארבע מאה זוזי״ — שמשום ספק
      הצלת נפש מישראל מדבר איסור לאיזה רגעים, לא חס על ממונו להתאפק
      לברר תחילה אם היא בת ישראל!

      My translation:

      “Firmness in matters of Torah and mitzvos must be not only when one is in yeshivah or the study hall; one must go out into the street…

      “Someone might claim that it’s impolite to go over to someone whom you don’t know, whom you have no idea what’s doing with him, and who you’re not even sure that he’s Jewish, since it’s not obvious from their face… The answer to this is that pikuach nefesh overrides everything; even for a doubtful case we clear the rubble [to save a Jew trapped underneath]. So it is with spiritual pikuach nefesh: even for a doubtful case (including where it’s doubtful whether he’s a Jew) we have do to everything possible to save his life.

      “This is similar to the story of the Gemara where Rav Adda bar Ahavah… ended up paying four hundred zuz. For a _doubtful_ case of saving a Jew from a forbidden act, for _a few minutes_, he cared nothing about his money, even to the extent of first asking whether she was Jewish!”

  • 68. # 24: wrote:

    “Did the Rebbe ever tell His secretariat to hang up signs that only those dressed appropriately come and get dollars…”

    Thank you!

  • 69. Elisheva Schwartz wrote:

    There is a reason why people live in crown Heights,
    and not park slope.!!

    We have higher standards!!

    And it’s sad that you see that think the non jews….

    Again crown Heights has higher standards then park slope, and the upper west side.

    We do welcome everyone And respect them.
    A long time before you came to this community.

    And btw one block from Kingston there is a house that belongs to the lubavicher Rebbe.. If you ever heard about him.

    Believe it or not your comment is
    RACISM / ANTI SEMITISM
    you make like CROWN HEIGHTS jews do not have respect for people. that is what YOU FEEL!!!

  • 70. Elisheva Schwartz wrote:

    If you respect other people’s views

    why would you rip down the Signs !!!!;((((

    THAT IS NOT RESPECTING PEOPLE’S VIEWS!!!

    YOU ARE A FULL OF IT !!!!!

  • 71. Andrea Schonberger wrote:

    People should just dress appropriately for every occasion. I have actually seen adults shopping in pajamas and slippers but I guess that IS modest compared to bikini tops and bootie shorts. Come on people get serious!

  • 72. Anonymous wrote:

    To # 21-I don’t understand how ripping off a woman’s garment is considered praisworthy. Isn’t that less tznius?

    • 73. Milhouse wrote:

      No, it’s exposing a prutza for what she is, and shaming her as she deserves. In any case, you don’t have to understand it, you have to accept it, because the gemoro says so.

    • 74. reply wrote:

      She was wearing a red/flashy garment.the gemara doesn’t say where it was worn but common sense would tell you that tearing it off made her more tznius not less.

  • 75. No Ahavas Isroel wrote:

    Fish smells from the head ….teach your daughter/son to be modest by being modest by yourself …modesty it’s not about the clothes but about your midos, deeds , manners , ahavas Isroel , etc ….

    • 76. YMSP wrote:

      It’s about all of those, but it’s about clothes maybe first, and what that leads to. Since the Midbar, this has been our protection – and one enhances the other (although all aspects need to be worked on).

  • 77. FACT wrote:

    The most important thing to remember is Crown Heights does not belong to Jews. People forget this. If one feels the need to put up signs do that in one’s Shul, school etc.
    Thank God we can live where we want and are not forced to live in ghettos. Putting up these signs will just create more anti Jewish sentiment which there is enough of already especially with whats going on in Israel.
    Anybody who argues the fact and believes we own Crown Heights is a fool.

    • 78. "Own"? wrote:

      We don’t have to “own” Crown Heights to proclaim that, because this neighborhood is a predominantly Orthodox Jewish one (in the parts of Crown Heights that ARE predominantly Lubavitch), we request respect of the fact that Judaism teaches that our dress should be modest.

      We’re not trying to force anyone to do anything. We’re not like another frum area that heckles and harasses those who flaunt their bodies.

      Those signs are just making a request! What, are you telling me that there’s some halachah saying it’s against Torah for Yidden to simply make a REQUEST like this?

  • 79. chanie G. wrote:

    The Rebbe is our nasi, our leader. The Rebbe spoke clearly and often about tznius and asked for people to increase in tznius and improve in those areas. He said many tragedies happened because of lack of tznius.
    So why is everyone trying to defend people who are not on the right level spiritually??
    Why condemn people who are trying to improve the shikun of Crown Heights?
    I think this is not about condemning anyone. This is about making an effort to do what is right. If the Rebbe felt it was important enough to speak about surely we can feel it is important enough to write about or put up signs about. To sit quiet and ignore problems does not help at all. Let people see that their behavior harms others. Let people see that lack of tznius affects others. If it was not important the Torah would not speak about it. And if it is important then we should speak about it! Yes people have free choice how they dress. Yes we need to have ahavas yisrael. But we dont have to lower our standards. Crown Heights is a special place and whatever we can do to improve the spiritual standards we must do, whether people like it or not. Imagine if a Jew suddenly wanted to sell treif in crown heights? dont you think people would say something??? This is not just a regular place….it is the Rebbes daled amos and we need to respect what the Rebbe wants.

  • 80. THERE IS A SOLUTION! wrote:

    If you find it hard to be told your way of dress is not beffiting THIS community, then move. But DO NOT create a negative environment where the tznius laws you follow become the norm.

    • 81. Interesting wrote:

      The Rebbe was insistent that Jews not move out of Crown Heights. He DID NOT say that to only the frummest and most tznius, he said it to all of us.

      Who are you to go against everything the Rebbe worked so hard for??? To reach out to each and every Jew, no matter what level they are up to, regardless of where they came from.

      No wonder he left us, because of people like you who misinterpret what he said and think you know better than the Rebbe. He worked tirelessly to ingrain us with love of our fellow Jews and made such a strict point to choose words carefully. You on the other hand are going against all of it, all in the name of it. Don’t you see how counterproductive that is??

    • 82. excuse me wrote:

      What do you mean no wonder why he left us? You expect one to live forever.

    • 83. THERE IS A SOLUTION! wrote:

      I’m sorry. I didn’t see it that way. The point of my words are that if you insist on polluting the community with immodesty even when you know the halacha….then I think its better to leave

  • 84. To All Fundamentalists... wrote:

    I find this sickening and repulsive! Hello?! Has anyone heard of the separation of church and state in the Constitution? Religious ideologies cannot, and will not, be enforced in any shape or form, regardless of neighbourhood. One of the main reasons as to why America is so great is because of this amendment of freedom.
    People can dress whatever way they want, and nobody should regulate nor dictate what is worn by others. There is not exception to the rule, regardless of ideology.

    • 86. It's not about "Enforcing" anything! wrote:

      It’s a request. It’s a statement of what our Torah teaches.

      Who said anything about “enforcing” it or “regulating” it?

      Have YOU ever heard of “Freedom of Speech,” which this is a matter of, plain and simple???? Just like “People can dress whatever they want” as you state, Orthodox Jews can “Request whatever they want”!

      And what “STATE” is involved? (You talk about “Separation of Church and state.) It’s not like we are asking a government office or official to get involved in tznius. It’s just a sign on a lamppost or telephone pole or building, with a REQUEST on it!

  • 87. AMERICA IS NISHT ANDERSH wrote:

    AMERICA IS NISHT ANDERSH!!!

    AMERICA IS NO DIFFERENT

  • 88. Just so you know... wrote:

    These quotes were stolen off someone’s FB page. They were never meant for public discussion.
    It was a few people having a discussion and someone violated someone else’s privacy.

    • 89. Interesting wrote:

      That seems to fine here in this twisted community. Stealing someone’s intellectual property is ok, but skirt length is not.

      TELL ME HOW THIS IS NOT HYPOCRISY.

    • 90. HAHAHA wrote:

      There is ZERO privacy for something posted on Facebook, Twitter or any other social media platform!

      If you posted it its public, quotable and admissible…

      If you have a problem with your views beings posted then perhaps you should take a long hard look in the mirror and reevaluate your principals and priorities.

      p.s. there is no intellectual property issues when it comes to statements/declarations.

  • 91. tznius is respect wrote:

    We are taught that tznius is respect for one’s soul because the body houses the soul. However how are girls supposed to know what respect is when they have teachers at school who curse them. How are they supposed to feel respect for their soul when others make fun of them because of learning problems, or financial standing, or because of their family background?
    Tznius is one of the challenges before Moshiach. The Rebbe said that one will listen when words from the heart go to the heart-these posters fail in that. They are not speaking to people-they are speaking at people. We all need to improve so Moshiach can come and if one cannot speak about tznius to someone heart-to-heart, it is better not to speak about it because it will have no effect.

    • 92. ok wrote:

      Will moshiach come only when the chabad community do what you said. Because in different Jewish communities things are different.

  • 93. Having self respect for yourself wrote:

    Our Rebbe has set up standards about tznius and spoke about it every summer (see the articles posted every week on this site).

    We all know that some women in the last few years have not even been embarrassed walking around somewhat exposed.

    For this, one dosen’t need halacha to guide the person. If you only have respect for yourself you would be appropriately dressed.

    Lately, women (not halacha) have designed their own tznius standards, and if someone says something to them, they get their husbands barking back at the person. This will not get them anywhere! Halacha will always prevail.

    In Kfar Chabad, they were instructed by the Rabbonim to take pix of such misbehavior.

    Women, for goodness sake, aren’t you embarrassed of yourselves?!

  • 94. Just Me wrote:

    This whole issue is repulsive – agree with #26 nothing is going to change with those stupid signs – how pathetic to even try.

  • 95. Missed the point wrote:

    Tznius is no longer an “awareness” issue. Every Frum girl is now well aware of what Tznius is. Much of the Rebbe’s emphasis on Tznius was awareness, as the Rebbe introduced new standards, and wanted women to know about and practice them.

    Tznius today is simply a huge challenge (Nisayon). Women want to dress fashionable and up-to-date, and it is very difficult to do so within the current Tznius standards.

    When the parents and Mechanchim start giving girls the tools with which to overcome this challenge, things will start to change. Hanging up signs like these serves to exacerbate the situation.

  • 96. please wrote:

    Elisheva Schwartz first dress tzniuse your self & than may be say some thing

  • 97. tznius with a shturm wrote:

    Here again most of the comments like to draw a picture that since the Rebbe didnt have a sign hung up by dollars that is a proof this is not the Rebbes way.Shimu Shomayim there were no signs that if you violated Borer you are not invited.There is a standard that the Rebbe held shpitz Chabad to and there was tolerance for other.There were misnagdem and other chasdim that came for Brachos,dollars etc none were asked how many mamarim they knew.Bu t the Rebbe in his shcunah for those beyond mekuravim demanded excellence.Tznius is not something for discussion.The idea of putting something on the streets is something which our Rabbanim should decide.This is something clearly which has to be dealt with as the breaches are violating halacha,Nebach a woman took her kid to school and felt humiliated dress properly you wont feel this way.The Rebbe never dealt with internet so should we ignore it.Filters are not required the Rebbe never dealt with it .The breaches have gotten worse .

  • 98. TO cHANI g wrote:

    i acknowledge totally that tznius is important.now..very important . I have listened to the Rebbe’s talks for 50 years..So I of course know how important tznius is to the Rebbe. Just as every mitzva is important….But if you want to weigh words and time that the Rebbe spent talking about mitzvas..Ahavas Yisroel far outweighs the mitzva of tznius…And I dont know why everyone jumps on the tznius problem bandwagon….But ahavas Yisroel is somehow not considered that important…This fact is non negotiable It is a face…Sad that the big Tznius baalei mussor are lacking the fundamental mitzva of ahavas yisroel..And that is the biggest problem. …U surely know the bais hamikdosh was destroyed because of sinaas chinum… I work in one of our mosdos where here too tznius is the biggest issue..so big that it takes precedence over ahavas yisroel and inyunei moshiach…I beg you to look up sichas that were said right prior to chof zayin adar and the 2 chief issues addressed by the Rebbe was ahavas yisroel and Moshiach….Tznius is a result of the lack of ahavas Yisroel in our community…Having said that I do not minimize tznius….But just as the Rebbe stressed these 2 issues of Ahavas Yisroel and Moshiach….If we really and honestly and truthfully practiced that tznius would not be a problem and Moshiach would be here….The Rebbe was prepping us for what to do so Moshiach should come

    • 99. Totally agree! wrote:

      Ahavas Yiroel is #1 and if we would spend our efforts in this in a true manner there are several issues that would fall into place – Tznius being one of them.

  • 100. Ignatz wrote:

    Last time I checked “Freedom of Speech” included the right to hang up a sign. .Anyone who doesn’t like what it says, doesn’t have to read it or follow what it says, but to prohibit hanging a sign, is against the Constitution. It’s not slanderous or racist, just an opinion – protected speech

  • 101. HURRAY!!!!!!!!!. wrote:

    I dont have time to read all the comments………….but im really glad these signs are goin up………….BETTER LATE THAN NEVER!! Even when people went for dollars they shouldve seen whats expected of them!! I dont know who to thank but THANK YOU!!

  • 102. Are we so open-minded that our brains are falling out? wrote:

    Remember that it is not against Halachah nor against the law to speak up (whether it’s in spoken words or in a poster). We don’t lose our freedom of speech simply because there are others than Orthodox Jews in the neighborhood.

    Rabbi Manis Friedman wrote an essay, “What Is the Cause of Anti-Semitism?” [http://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/2902/jewish/What-Is-the-Cause-of-Antisemitism.htm], which includes the following points that I think are applicable:

    “….The world is not only willing to accept that Jews are different [chosen to fulfill G-d’s mission and to act as G-d’s ambassadors]; the world wants Jews to be different.
    “….The world wants leadership and who are they going to look to for moral leadership if not the Jews?”
    “….To sum up, in being chosen, we have one of three options. Either we’re going to continue to insist we never heard of it. Or we’re going to continue to vacillate and not know whether we’re coming or going, or what to say.
    “Or we’re going to stand up straight and say, “Yes, we’re different, we’re Jewish, we’re created from G-d’s thought. Yes, we are chosen and we therefore must live up to that title.”

    (I’m not trying to say that I speak for Rabbi Friedman, of course. I just feel that his essay is relevant here.)

  • 103. Mezzuzah,Teffilin wrote:

    If there was a sign to put on Teffilin or put up mezzuzahs nobody would have a problem with it. So why is Tznuis different? Ahhhh ..I bet you know the answer!

  • 104. WOW-To millhouse wrote:

    Dude, are you aware that Non-Jews are only obligated to keep the 7 Noachide Laws? In regards to Shabbat, it even states in the Tanach, that If a non-Jew keeps shabbat, that it is considered a grave sin. Most of our Halachot-Including Tzniut-do not apply at all to Non-Jews.

  • 108. Hashgacha protis wrote:

    Yidden,

    we find ourselves in very dark times.

    The Jewish world is now talking about the lack of Tzniyus in the Rebbe’s shchuna, we must take action now!

    It is deffinatly a sign from above for our good.
    It might be embarrassing, but its only for our good.

    Hatzlacha to everyone, and much Love and good news to Am Yisroel.

  • 109. stop already wrote:

    First of all this is the U.S. so no you don’t control how people dress in the streets.Milhouse, you need help for sure.To rip someones’ garment off and this is your example is soooo inappropriate.As if anyone but a sicko would dare do that in this time or any place.So why even bring it up?Stop blaming women for catastrophes.Maybe your over preoccupation with women and their clothes is a sign of what is going on your male heads.Only H’ knows what and why things happen.Not mortals so stop guessing.Men, you are way tooo involved with women.Take out a sefer and start learning some more instead thinking about women all the time.Not a good thing for men to do.

    • 110. To #77 wrote:

      Chavah, a woman, the Torah states, brought death to the world. No big deal, just death. I read that in a sefer, as you said. It’s called Breishis. I am not guessing, look it up.

    • 111. Milhouse wrote:

      How can you say that what R Ada bar Ahava did was inappropriate, when the gemoro says the exact opposite? I brought it up to prove that “minding other people’s business” about tznius is a kidush haShem, not a chilul haShem.

  • 112. to all the milhouse comments.. wrote:

    If your the same person… keep it up! to all the pple who r against the signs : the signs would have not been up if women would be dressed the way HASHEM wants us to be dressed! and if the signs went up it’s because Hashem wanted it otherwise it would have NEVER happened!HASHEM is in control of HIS WORLD NOT any person!imagine your in the 3rd bais hamikdash or in front of the Rebbe would u want Hashem to see u or the Rebbe dressed the way that u are? to the pple who can’t find tznuis clothes pls as the Rebbe says from the 12 pesukim “…yogatee umotzosee taamin!” in gerenal pls when talking and responding ahavas yisrael should be the kavanah as the Rebbe says it should come from the heart then it’ll enter.

    • 113. You make no sense wrote:

      How does it make sense that god can control the sign being put up but not the way people dress? If “he”controls the world why is this even an issue? Isn’t whatever happens “his” doing?

  • 114. tznius with a shturm wrote:

    What a silly issue cause it isnt stressed in the sichos neither is bishul or shiluch akain.The REBBE always spoke about SHULCAN ARUCH.Some other poster when this topic was brought had the gall to say lets not be frummer than our Rebbitzen go ask mechila from her.

  • 115. Amazing wrote:

    Amazing how the poster wasn’t gender specific but as usual the topic of tznuis and modesty seems to fall on women. So lets call this problem what it is people. It’s a women’s problem. Men seem to have no problem in this department. Right guys.

    • 116. Milhouse wrote:

      Tznius is mostly a women’s problem, because the requirements for women are much harder to obey than the requirements for men, and also because the yetzer horoh for dressing attractively is stronger for women than for men. It’s a big nisoyon, and the men must not forget this. By all means women must be asked, begged, cajoled, rebuked, etc., to do what the Torah demands of them; but if they do not, then men must remember to be careful in judging them. This is the difference between exhortation for the future, and blaming for the past. As the Tanya says, to judge someone else it’s not enough to say that you — as you are — wouldn’t have done what the other person did; you must imagine what you would have done if you were in that person’s position, with that person’s yetzer horo, and consider that you might have done even worse. The other person must stop doing wrong, and you should tell them that, but that doesn’t justify judging them for what they have already done.

  • 117. TO NUMBER 8 wrote:

    you are 100% right this is what my wife struggles with most.
    the role models look like garbage.
    there is no big koch in fashionable tznius clothing?!?!
    the stores don’t have or are impossible to shop for tznius clothing…
    tznius clothing is crazy expensive bc every item you buy needs to be played with and adjusted????
    where is the community????

  • 118. YMSP wrote:

    One sad thing that comes out of all this is that 20 years ago no one would have questioned this campaign and everyone would have been in shock at the way tzinus is trampled upon.

    Today point out that women need to show self respect and that men need to watch their eyes – and that both need to act Jewish, and you have screaming posters comparing that to “blaming women for soldier’s deaths” R”L.

    The liberal American mentality of pitting men against women and all groups against each other (telling Blacks that they can’t succeed, so that many don’t or telling people that near infanticide is a “rights” and “gender equality” issue, or encouraging divorce) is sick and has no place in the Torah world.

    The Torah doesn’t change and the segulos for Hashem’s protection, and the outward things that either make the place ra’uy on the simplest level for Hashem and Hashem’s brochos vs things that ch”v chase them away don’t change. The foundations of Jewish life, based on the actual deed of dressing modestly and guarding one’s eyes don’t change.

    The only thing that changes is the yeridas hadoros and the fact these tests are harder (and therefore more important – and also come with greater reward) today. We can delude ourselves, but then we’re only getting offended at Hashem’s Torah instead of looking out for our own good and Hashem’s blessings.

    It should be repeated again: in any other time those who express outrage on this matter might as well have been saying “who are you to tell me not to eat pork?”

  • 119. Haha wrote:

    It’s very difficult when you teach kids the right way and the teachers tell them to dress the right way and then later they go in the streets and see the same teacher is doing otherwise that becomes very confusing to them

    • 120. Milhouse wrote:

      Yes, that’s a problem, but one has to remember that a teacher is also a human being with a yetzer horo. When you see a teacher doing wrong, you don’t know how hard she fought the nisoyon before failing it, or what her yetzer horo originally wanted her to do — maybe she only failed 10% of the nisoyon and passed 90% of it, and this “compromise” is keeping her from doing something much worse. That doesn’t justify what she’s doing, but it does help understand it. After all, we are not beinunim either.

      This is hardly restricted to women, or to tznius. Let’s consider something that applies mostly to men, and that is perhaps even harder to keep than tznius for women. It’s very difficult when teachers tell kids not to talk during davening, and then they’re in 770 and see the same teacher replying to a comment from his neighbor. And yet we men all know how hard it is to refrain! Just one sentence, or even just one word! It’s difficult, very difficult, and yet we also know how terrible an aveira it is, and what tragedies it causes r”l.

      Talk about “blaming women for soldiers dying”! How about blaming men who talk in shul for children dying, nisht af unz gedacht, rachmono litzlan. But we know that it’s so. And yet, every time we make a hachloto not to do it any more, how long does it last? Honestly, now.

      So yes, these signs are right and proper, but there are other things that also need to be done. (I’m not calling for signs about this, only because every shul already has them. If there’s a shul that doesn’t, maybe it should put some up.)

  • 121. LA MORAH wrote:

    Go look at the many comments on this story on Vos Iz Naies regarding what others think of the tznius of Crown Heights. This is pathetic and embarrassing. Rebbe,what a busha!!

  • 122. Zelda wrote:

    I agree that there is a problem with the girls today not dressing as modest as they should. That is taught within the home,and problems may occur inside that home which the child is rebelling in an un tzniot matter to get back at the family.However,to make a public statement on Kingston is downright Chutspah, Who are you to tell everyone walking down a public street how to dress? We make ourselves look ridiculous,That sighn should be taken down immediately! It makes the goyim laugh at our demands,our selfishness,our rudeness,and lack of intolerance. If anything,We must teach our
    children,and unfortunately,our adults as well, to learn to be polite to ALL..You want to eat cake,eat cake,but don’t throw it down everyone’s throat,you come off as a crazy Jews,and thats the last thing we need in our lives especially now!! Someone rip it down…..

    • 123. To #89 Zelda wrote:

      Did you ask the goyim? I did. I test these things out. Not ONE laughed. They were very pleased. They thought it to be very respectful and thoughtful. Who is the rude and selfish one. Look in the mirror, ZELDA.

  • 124. Tzivia wrote:

    I think everyone is missing the point. This is the Rebbe’s place. Out of respect for our nasi hador we need to respect tznius. A sign reminding us is not the issue. There would be no need for signs if people would follow the chassidish path.
    And it is not against freedom or it is not lack of ahavas yisrael because we are not telling goyim how to dress. Nor are we addressing non frum yidden. This is all about the frum kehilla. If you are considering yourself part of the frum kehilla you need to dress the part. you need to be an example to others. you need to give nachas to the Rebbe. And there is no need to get upset if others remind anyone.
    when frum yidden live among goyim and they see goyim not dressing properly, or even non frum yidden not dressing properly, it is obviously not nice but it is not the same as when they see other so called frum people not dressing properly. the impact is much more negative. it is a responsibility. We need to consider the impact we have on others.

  • 125. The Rebbe's derech - wrote:

    By the way to all of you,
    yes, the Rebbe did act in a way where he spoke more about tznius then any other rebbe in the last 100 years! And he did have a note hanging in 770 that said that girls from the age of 3 should dress b’tznius.
    Don’t try to change history. The Rebbe was a Kanui when it came to tznius. You can see it in Sichos, letters and on some videos. Just look at the language. There is no – if you wouldn’t mind then please or how about?
    You ask why nobody put up signs by dollars? You gotta be kidding; do you think anyone came so –dressed to the Rebbe?
    People didn’t dress modestly then because they were afraid. They came to the Rebbe with dignity and respect! Chassidim dressed like chassidim and others dressed respectfully according to their level of Yiddishkeit and were sometimes handed scarves when necessary, and nobody protested.

  • 126. beautiful wrote:

    I think that the sign is nicely done from a marketing point of view. It is very calming and colorful. Just wonder what the African-Americans think when they see that they are in a Jewish community. I think that most yuppies would be respectful as they don’t have much of a community here and we share their skin color by and large.

    • 127. the African-Americans wrote:

      (and the non-Jews who are neither African nor American!!) actually know they are in a Jewish community.
      They can’t even buy bread or milk on shabbos, and get very concerned when it’s a 3-day yom tov.
      I know, because they are my next door neighbors on the left and on the right of me. They ask when they have to stock up on basic supplies! How many non-Jewish owned stores are there on Kingston or Albany?
      Yes, this IS a Orthodox Jewish Community, even though many people don’t behave the way they should.

  • 128. star gazer wrote:

    We will prevail. The Rebbe has hope that the Jewish women will be the ones to bring Moshiach, as he repeatedly said “in the merit of the righteous women our fathers were redeemed, (and so too now, in their merit, we will be redeemed)”. We just have to look back and see how the Jewish women in Egypt behaved. They did not change: 1. their language 2. their names 3. their way of dressing. They did not conform to the Egyptian style and culture – even though it was difficult for them and it was before Mattan Torah.
    At this time of tzoros and war in Israel the Rebbe writes (Parshat Bamidbor in Hosafot Page 226 &227): The Jews who live in Eretz Yisroel need a special brocha from Hashem, to remove them from the situation which they are currently in. “you will sit securely in your land”, “When you sleep, nothing shall scare you and there should be no need for a guard”. For this to happen, one needs the concept of Tznius, like it says, “Hashem, your G-D, walks between your camp” – which happens as an outcome that “ERVA is not seen by you”. When Hashem sees that by Jews the opposite of tznius is non-existent, THEN, He walks among you to save you and put the enemy in your hands, so that you won’t have to do anything yourself (because Hashem is your Savior). All the enemies will be destroyed…until his enemies will make peace with him…and peace will reign in the land until they (enemies) will be the ones to make and request peace from the Yidden.
    Now is the appropriate time to make changes for the better. Our actions have an effect on the safety of Eretz Yisroel. We must act now and be the ones who will bring Moshiach.

  • 129. Avromie from Texas wrote:

    Why does everyone assume it is for the Women.

    In the Living Torah from just last week, the Rebbe said that Znius is for everyone.

    From an outsider, the signs displayed in the image above look very respectful.

    I imagine that some people took offence where probably our own that feel self conscious. To them I say, do a chesbon nefesh, try and recognize what is right and go in your own pace in that direction.

  • 130. sad wrote:

    every comment reeks of sinaas chinum .And THAT is why Moshiach is not here…fact…fact…fact

  • 131. agree wrote:

    that is so true The lack of tznius is a result of the sinnaas chinum and hypocricy And by the way….men checking out womans’ tznius is the ultimate lack of tznius….In one of our mosdos that boast their superior tznius a MAN is the one checking out their skirts and necks….so there you have it…HYpocricy at work Disgusting

  • 132. WHY IS EVERYONE MAKING SUCH A BIG DEAL? wrote:

    IF YOU DON’T LIKE THE SIGNS…
    IGNORE THEM.

    IF YOU LIKE THE SIGNS…
    KEEP IT IN YOUR HEART, AND LISTEN TO THEM.

    NOT A CONTROVERSIAL TOPIC HERE.
    I JUST WANT TO PINT OUT, I AM A GIRL IN ELEMENTARY SCHOOL, I DON’T LIVE IN CH, AND I AM TELLING
    YOU
    THIS THING. QUIT EMBARRASSING.

  • 133. To Milhouse wrote:

    Belive what you want. But to enforce or even advise this believes on others will backfire on you. Your not batter then the fantastical Talbien and ISIS

    • 134. YMSP wrote:

      Um, comparing people who peacefully hang up signs encouraging others to adhere to age old foundations of Judaism to mass murdering hit squads may be chic, New Yorkish and De Blas-ish, but it does sound like a tad bit of a stretch all the same.

    • 135. Ezra wrote:

      In other words, you are saying that there is no difference between Torah (shebiksav and shebaal peh) and, lehavdil, the Koran and hadiths. The Taliban enforce their view of the latter, we try to enforce our view of the former, but you’re saying that both are equally wrong.

      Perhaps you need to give a good hard look at yourself and at what you believe – and don’t believe – about the Torah.

    • 136. you disagree.??!! wrote:

      You r not asked to beleive in milhouse beliefs ch”v – you are commanded ( and u even said naase v’nishma) by Hashem at mount sinai to follow Hashem’s torah and His ways- and milhouse is just bringing it out what Hashem wants. as the Frierdiker Rebbe says in Basi legani “every jew has to ask himself ‘when will my deeds approach the deeds of my forefathers…?’ NO bounds blocks or obstacles whatever can prevent a jew from elevating himself and attaining a closeness to G-d…”pls a reminder when speaking or responding ONLY with ahavas yisrael then it’ll enter ONLY if it’s what Hashem wants not coming from a human being.

  • 138. YMSP wrote:

    Was talking it over with someone who believes strongly in the inyan but thought that the signs might backfire (for the record I still think it’s better than nothing and no writer is perfect).

    Also seeing some of the comments on this board, presumably from people who the signs would be directed at, made me wonder.

    Tzinus is necessary for Hashem to dwell in a revealed way in our midst (as revealed as possible during golus, and helps bring the geulah haamitis vhasheleima). Tzinus and shmiras einayim are also needed in bringing down extra (miraculous) protection for Israel and its soldiers.

    Since today, the message of tzinus and its role at the very foundation of Judaism appears not to be understood, why not make a sign that explains the above? Namely, that tzinus and shmiras einayim (guarding one’s eyes):

    – bring Moshiach quicker than anything else
    – are one of the best ways to help save an Israeli soldier’s life
    – safeguard the people of Israel
    – bring Hashem’s blessings into our own lives
    – protect the community in all ways and draw extraordinary blessings down for it

    Wouldn’t such a sign be more effective and get people to think (as the explained truth always does)?

    • 139. YMSP wrote:

      More problems with the language. Someone in shul (not in CH) was talking about it and thought that the signs were meant for Non-Jews. That would be wrong and have halachic problems as well. The idea is very good and needed but these things should be done with a Vaad, people who know PR, etc.

  • 140. Lame wrote:

    We have much bigger problems in the lubavitch and Jewish community.

    ISRAEL IS AT WAR. Instead of wasting your time commenting… SAY TEHILLIM!!!

    Keep your noses out of other peoples clothes. It has nothing to do with you. And if you have a problem with the way they dress. Then you need to see a mental health doctor.

  • 141. star gazer wrote:

    The bottom line is we choose where we want to belong. Let’s stop blaming and pointing fingers and making excuses for everything. Are we part of the Rebbe’s chassidim, where he had confidence and saw our potential, trusted us and believed in us and knew that Hashem gave us the strength needed to overcome this nisayon, and be or become the noshim tzidkaniyos that will be instrumental (through our actions and tznius) in bringing safety and more security to Israel and in bringing the geula. Or are we part of the group that complains, points fingers, finds fault, blames and takes offense on every comment that people throw our away – this attitude does not help us grow or improve in any way. It’s just an excuse to justify our actions and why we don’t have to do anything positive to create change (as is evident by people that always blame others for their behavior).

  • 142. WOW-To millhouse wrote:

    Milhouse-please see COMMON SENSE. And as such, we must conduct ourselves with the highest amount of respect and dignity. When-since when-is tearing off a woman’s clothes in public in line with that? It would have been better if the Rabbi would have just quietly walked over to her, instead of embarrasing her in public like that. It’s sickening. And Milhouse, i hate to break the news to you, but Rabbi’s are not Hashem. They can make mistakes too, just like the rest of us. Hashem gave us free will, and with that, subsequently came a lack of judgement. Even great Rabbi’s are at risk for that. Another Example would be when Rabbi Akiva thought that Bar Kochba was Mashiach. Obviously, didn’t happen. Rabbi’s don’t always have the correct answer. Only Hashem knows the true answers. He gave us some locks to pick, and some tools to pick those locks, but he by no means gave us the keys.

    • 143. pls wrote:

      The Rebbe said avraham avinu conducted his life with mesuras nefesh. does it say it anywhere in tanach? about the example of moshiach -WE didn’t do r part to deserve him. tzaddikim NEVER MAKE MISTAKES. Hashem gave us the choice to choose when we make the wrong choice because we r not following HIS commandments or ways ch”v we shouldn’t complain when things don’t go right. it says it clearly in the chumash if u follow Hashem’s ways then all the good crops etc.. if not ch”v….

    • 144. Ezra wrote:

      You know what’s sickening? The fact that you are making the same mistake that we learn about every Tisha B’Av – the mistake of the biryonim (Gittin 56a). They claimed to know better than the rabbis – “let’s go and fight against the Romans,” they argued, against the rabbis who wanted to make peace. After all, the biryonim argued, as you are doing, what do the rabbis know? They’re not Hashem!

      And so the actions of the biryonim led to the murderous siege of Jerusalem and to the destruction of the city and of the Beis Hamikdash. For 1900+ years we mourn at this time of year, because of people who just “wanted to break the news that rabbis are not Hashem” and acted accordingly.

      Chew on that a little!

    • 145. pls... wrote:

      He has a point. Maybe Hashem wanted that to happen did you forget.

  • 146. Joesef wrote:

    The street may be “public” but they still part of g-d’s world , u have to behave properly & dress properly.

  • 147. Joesef wrote:

    To 110
    Do u go In the streets often?
    Do u notice the street lights say “DON’T WALK”
    “WALK” or something like” Don’t walk on the grass ”
    Or a sign on the doors in the train “do not lean on doors ” or some places say” no swimming ” etc.
    Do these signs offend you , why are they telling me what to do…. America is a free country !

  • 148. bas yisroel wrote:

    The issue is not modest dress but immodest undress. Why should a tzniusdik person be offended by such a sign? [I dont necessarily agree with putting up theses signs but its high time we wake up to this painful problem in our community]

  • 149. to milhouse (re ada bar ahvah) wrote:

    Citing ada bar ahva as a exaple shows on a gross misunderstanding of hashkofa . Ada bar ahva was a tzadik somone with pure intentions especially and not only in his action of ripping of the clothing but also in his feelings on seeing a women dressed untznius there was no anger rage.. somthing one sees in the comments here. Milhouse im going to assume that your mothers father was פיתם עגלים לעבודה זרה

    • 150. Ezra wrote:

      You do realize, don’t you, that your kind of argument was discredited by no less than Hashem Himself (by tracing Pinchas’ lineage to Aharon)? Why, one might well apply here a different expression from the Gemara about that story: you are of the type who are עושין מעשה זמרי ומבקשין שכר כפנחס.

      Also, where do you see “anger rage”? Besides for in your own mind, that is; כל הפוסל במומו פוסל.

    • 151. to milhouse (re ada bar ahvah) wrote:

      Reply to EZRA :: First on the anger and rage .assuming that you are the only ezra look at comment 129) were you write its sickening (hardly passive language) and then comment 59) you are full of it.

      And legabei hashem himself discrediting my argument apparently you missed the point obviously in regard to pinchas the argument was wrong but it took hashem to prove it . Milhouse and whoever hung up signs doesnt have hashems haskoma .especially this Milhouse (hopefully unintentionally)encouraging the rippong off of clothing berabim so ezra pls take the time to understand the argument first before replying.

      And pls clarify your talmud quote because I don’t see the connection

    • 152. to the comment right above this one wrote:

      Pls go back and see comment “#101 to all milhouse comments…” regarding Hashem’s haskama

    • 153. Ezra wrote:

      Okay, “to milhouse,” so you’ve found what you claim to be “anger and rage” in my comments. What’s that got to do with your ranting against Milhouse? I have no idea who he is, but I can assure you that he and I are not the same person. (Mind you, neither of us put up the signs either; we’re just pointing out that it was right to do so.)

      (I might also add that my “sickening” comment was in reply to a commenter who used that term to second-guess an Amora’s actions, as you can see for yourself – read comment 128.)

      You say that whoever hung up the signs “doesn’t have Hashem’s haskoma.” How would you know? Do you have a direct line to Hashem that bypasses the Shulchan Aruch?

      (And you know perfectly well that neither Milhouse nor I nor any other commenter is suggesting that we go rip off people’s untzniusdik clothing. The point was that if the Gemara praises Rav Adda for doing so, then al achas kamah vechamah that putting up signs requesting tzniusdik dress is the right thing to do.)

      You ask me to clarify my Talmud quote? It speaks of “those who act like Zimri” – perpetrating and encouraging a lack of tznius – “and expect a reward like Pinchas,” thinking that they’re the “moderates” who deserve Hashem’s covenant of peace.

  • 154. To #95 wrote:

    Since when do we say that tzniusly dressed women look like garbage?

  • 155. Anonymous wrote:

    I agree with Mrs. Schwartz that it’s diverse and all the other women who choose to dress they way they want it would just be nice if anybody does approach you in regards to the way you dress if they would say that you’re living in the neighborhood just because their parents were there for many years they so happen to be born there and the lubavitch rebbe is not someone who they follow or asks for any blessings from and that they follow a different rabbi and opinion. because if they do follow the Lubavitcher rebbe and go to him for blessings then the least we can do is to fulfill what he asked us to do as being we are his children.

  • 156. ? wrote:

    I wish the person who put up signs should just say who is it for…who are they trying to reach her

  • 157. Won't help wrote:

    You can’t shame people into behaving appropriately, at the most you might be able to shame them into putting on a front but internally they will only be more distance cv”h. There was an article in N’shei about a non-frum photographer who came to a wedding and wasn’t dressed nicely. He sat by a non-Chabad table and everyone was scolding him, asking how he could show up to a chasunah like that. Chabad welcomed him with open arms, and he wrote about how much he appreciated it. Guess who has the zchus of the many mitzvos he now keeps? It’s a fact that if someone knows you’re judging/criticizing them, they aren’t able to listen. Maybe they should be able to hear the message regardless, but our generation also has a big nisayon of low self-confidence, and this is just how it works. They need to know you care about them personally and are speaking from a place of love and recognition of their vital importance to Hashem. No sign can convey this.
    Many people agree there’s a problem of tznius in general, but what we have is a situation where everyone knows the halacha and all the scolding and policing hasn’t worked. It is up to the mechanchim to work harder at discovering the root causes and developing a better approach to dealing with this nisayon, instead of intensifying the same failed policy.

  • 158. free Jewish schooling wrote:

    Such a beautiful sign. Why would anyone oppose it?
    Crown Heights is obviously a Jewish neighborhood.

  • 159. Jewish Neighborhood wrote:

    This has always been a Jewish and Black neighborhood shared, sometimes with trouble, usually not. Now it has become and is becoming more and more inhabited by white gentiles or non-religious Jews with a completely different outlook on life than our community. When you let them in you open yourselves up to having to accept their way of life in your face – their music, their way of dressing, their opinions of us, their voice. Greed let them in, and now you sow what you have reaped. You want their money to pay for apartments that are overpriced and most Lubavitchers cannot afford so you are basically giving them our Schuna. So get ready to see more and more bare white skin!

  • 160. tznius is beautiful. wrote:

    im so thankful we have rules to keep our dignity.

    its also the least we can do to help protect our sisters and brothers who are physically fighting for us in EY-

    at least do your part- the spiritual one that will help them.

    Hashem is treating them based on your actions. ity says an action of a jew on one side of the world impacts a jew on the other side.
    ESPECIALLY we are told that our tznius DIRECTLY affects the safety of the yidden in EY.
    its a fact!!

    so if you wont do it for yourself and your own integrity- do it for your family, and for other yidden at least…

  • 162. Joeseph wrote:

    What’s wrong with dressing modestly , is this a violation ? Is this a crime ? It only makes you and those who are around give you respect ! Don’t you want to respect yourself , this is where it starts.

  • 163. tznius with a shturm wrote:

    New shtyuot whenever the concept of tznius comes up stop sinas chinam.Maybe you should look in the mirror and realize that when you are machsil someone else thats sinas chinam.

  • 164. move wrote:

    I gotta say that the hasidic orthodox jews of crown hieghts are a bunch of hypocrites.
    They have alot of nerve asking people to coverup. If they want to live in a kibbutz or shetl move .
    Thier conservative religious values are an affront to the free American lifestyle of tolerance.
    If you want to have gestapo mullahs telling women how to dress. Move to Iran or saudi arabia. You will fit in there fine. We do not need you here.
    Please leave and take your backwards ways back to Eastern Europe.

    • 165. Joeseph wrote:

      What’s wrong with dressing modestly , is this a violation ? Is this a crime ? It only makes you and those who are around give you respect ! Don’t you want to respect yourself , this is where it starts.

    • 166. Ezra wrote:

      I gotta say that you are a hypocrite.

      You have a lot of nerve asking people to leave because they disagree with you. If you want to live in a totalitarian society, move.

      Your authoritarian values are an affront to the free American lifestyle of tolerance.

      If you want to have Gestapo mullahs telling you what you can and can’t say, move to Iran or Saudi Arabia. You will fit in there fine. We do not need you here.

      Please move and take your backwards ways back to Nazi Germany.

  • 167. I am Crown Heights wrote:

    The reality is that Crown Heights is not a gated community and while their is an orthodox population there are other people from all walks of life who have roots in this community too. I am a Haitian American, born and raised in Crown Heights and I was highly offended when I walked out of my home to view these signs. “this is a jewish community”? Well, it is also a west indian community..a Hispanic community..etc.
    I was actually very surprised that these signs were put up because:
    1. No one outside of the orthodox Jewish community is actually going to follow the vague request to dress “modestly” (the sign does not actually define what “modest” is…perhaps it is implied that we should dress as the those in the orthodox Jewish community dresses?
    2. Whoever put up these signs does not have the historical context of this community or simply does not care i.e crown heights riots, i.e race relations
    3. I was surprised that anyone in 2014 living in New York City would actually go as far to imply that somehow their way of life was better than the other 8.3 million New Yorkers living in this city. Was that the intent?.. I dont know. Is that how it came across. Obviously,yes
    4. According to nyc.gov..70.4% of crown heights is actually black..14.6% is hispanic…9.1% white…1.7% is asian. Despite these factual numbers, Crown Heights is a mixed community. It just is what it is and that should be embraced and respected.

    In conclusion, we all just need to learn how to respect each other and figure your out your own way of preserving your way of life without imposing on anyone else’s. The world would be a much better place if we respected each others beliefs and ways of life.

    • 168. pls don't get offended by my question wrote:

      The main question is if your jewish or not? in any case it’s clear that a lot percent (i don’t know how much) is jewish. G-D the creator of heaven and earth gave us – the jewish pple, His bible which clearly states that -especially the women should dress modest and gave us guidelines how it should be done. unfortunately for some jews a reminder is needed. we r not imposing beliefs we are reminding are jewish brothers to remember G-D (which every jew believes in his soul)who wants us to keep His guidelines of modesty which are stated in His bible.

  • 170. sinas chinam wrote:

    is by those of us who arent tznius…
    completely disrespecting everyone and everything around us. selfish. irresponsible. and yet expecting to be accepted?

    and to say those who are tznius look like garbage???
    is that ahavas yisrael???

    since when is it beautiful to look like a low-life?
    there are many beautifully tznius women
    but if youre embarassed to look jewish then the problem is much deeper….
    tznius is an indication of a persons level of yiras shomayim.
    theres a reason why it was in the zchus of the women keeping their dress that brought Geula
    and why the safety of the yidden in EY is dependant on it- because its such a struggle the reward is so great.

    its embarassing what the world sees of us:
    we who are supposed to be leading others….

    http://www.vosizneias.com/173258/2014/07/28/brooklyn-ny-signs-in-crown-heights-ask-residents-to-cover-up-in-jewish-community/

    kol hakovod to those who make hachlotos in this area!

  • 171. Joeseph wrote:

    To mr. 149
    I feel very comfortable here in AMERICA . Freedom of religion , I can practice & live religiously without fear , g-d bless America for the privilege I have to be in this country …
    But if u do something that is “morally” wrong I will speak up , it’s as simple as that !!!
    If I c someone doing a transgression against an other human , I will tell him stop … Don’t tell me go back to eastern Europe .
    Look , if you do a good thing I will complement you
    And vise versa.

  • 172. to tznius with a shturem wrote:

    yes….You sound exactly like the hypocrites i fear here in Crown Heights….And your kind is very dangerous…You definitely do not represent Chabad .Why even bother talking to you..?? And Number 153 is right…A large part of our community is black….How about they put up signs we should all wear their braids? They are really pretty and not untzniusdik

  • 173. to tznius with a shturem also wrote:

    Interesting your title is tznius with a shturem and of course not ahavas yirsroel with a shturem….Because you would never hold yourself up to that title….Can just see that from your posts

  • 175. Amused Observer wrote:

    This is a Jewish neighborhood just like America is a Christian nation.

    • 176. Your statement is correct. wrote:

      America is a Christian nation based on Judeo-Christian values which differs us from the European Christian countries. Here there is freedom for everyone and we are all welcome and safe here. The Jewish nation is Israel. But here in America we do form communities and Crown Heights is a shared Black and Jewish neighborhood. The few streets surrounding Kingston Ave. are home to primarily Jewish Orthodox so to request modesty in dress when visiting our home is not such a terrible request. To dress somewhat modestly is to respect yourself and others.

  • 177. tznius with a shturm wrote:

    Here we go again ahavas yisroel.If someione wad feeding pork with a hechsher on KINGSTON Ave nobody would say protesting is sinas chinam.Shmiras enayim is a lav diorasa .So for us chasidim we want the same level of tznius as we demand in kashrus.Too bad you didnt meet the Amoraim who also were moche.The REbbe protested when ever he saw a breach in halacha and didnt let ahavas yisroel block it,Tocha was given by the same Hashem who gave the Torah.

  • 178. CRUELTY!!! wrote:

    Well, that’s too bad if the title is extreme. But, that’s what untznius really is – “PROFESSINAL SADISM.” Now, I’m not a woman, so maybe yes or no. But, for a man, this is torture of the mind!
    To say don’t look – I mean that’s absurd. You just can’t help seeing what’s right in front of you and peripherally, unless, CH”V, you are visually handicapped or are wearing welder’s goggles. True, when you do see it, look away. The problem is that once you get that glimpse, uh-oh!….Hope I don;t have to go any further.

    • 179. One word for you... wrote:

      self control. I know that’s cruelty but you must help yourself and stop putting blame on the other gender. It makes you weak mentally and spiritually.

    • 180. "CRUELTY" has a point wrote:

      We women are not supposed to place a stumbling block in front of a blind person.

  • 182. Religious standards wrote:

    Don’t religious people (e.g Christian, Muslim) also have a dress code, not much different than what the signs expect from the Jews? This does not mean the same syle, but, you know, certain body areas covered.

    In any case, the signs are directed at the Jews, so why should this upset anyone else, any more than Muslim signs demanding their faithful to come and pray?

  • 183. ABOUT TIME !! wrote:

    THANK YOU!!! THANK YOU!!!
    THANK YOU!!!
    THANK YOU!!!
    THANK YOU!!!
    THANK YOU!!!
    THANK YOU!!!
    THANK YOU!!!
    THANK YOU!!!
    This is how its done classy and professional .
    THANKS KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK!!
    G-OD BLESS THE JEWISH COMMUNITY

  • 185. to tznius with a shturem also wrote:

    no use talking to you….You apparently will never understand our problem and how to solve it

  • 186. Yochanan wrote:

    I think these sign was intended for the one it fits.
    Like the famous example of the tzemach tzedek with the hat manufacturer who makes hats!!!
    If u dress modestly fine , may you be blessed with all good things for you and your loved ones
    And if u need to improve , may this sing serve as encouragement to to better and receive all the good things from your creator in great measure.

  • 187. kanai wrote:

    tzinus with a shturem sounds a bit radical for asking us people to keep halacha but this fellow has dome valid points.The idea about the Rebbe not let things pass under the mask of ahavas yisroel is true.If we feel this part of haalcah has to be dealt with tolerance could be. But the Rebbe taught us oib es tut veh shreit men.

  • 190. Joan wrote:

    It’s not about my dress code
    It’s not about my streets
    It’s not about my laws or beliefs
    It’s about living like decent human beings in a way that I can respect you & you respect me …
    Getting dressed ” modestly ” meaning covering yourself with cloths “properly ” !!! Is what it’s about.

  • 191. Yoseph wrote:

    In the “book of ethics ” it says , except the truth from whoever tells it to you , do not be offended .!

  • 192. Chen wrote:

    The only problem I see is by the time you notice the sign you already got dressed…

  • 193. Joe wrote:

    As a non-Jew I see no problems with the signs. They are polite and not pushy. And I think you just have to look at what has happened as a result of putting up the signs – division between people. Lesson is that anytime one group says our way is best, there will always, always be an opposing group saying the opposite – creating division and discord. It is a law of the universe which mankind still fails to understand.

  • 195. Native Iroquois wrote:

    If you lot cannot live together – then its time to go back to where you come from. There is too much war, hate and hurtful things going on in the world to worry about such petty issues.

    Live as one – or go.

  • 196. James Briggs wrote:

    1. I think that the public streets are owned by everything. How would Jews feel if in another community there was signs saying this is a Black Community so you better dress and talk black. 2. “a husband’s duty to supervise his wife’s clothing.” Yesterday I was polling for the Democrats and when I asked if a woman if she supported the Democrats she said she’d have to ask her husband. Is that how it is among Jews.

  • 197. Cpt Obvious wrote:

    Oh and by the way, this great city of New York if I remember correctly is a fashion LEADER not follower. Go to some third world country where you can oppress women.

  • 198. CrankyPants wrote:

    “‘This is a Jewish Neighborhood’ is claiming ownership and exclusion to others; [is it] covered in the First Amendment?” wrote one critic. “It is discriminatory.”

    Really? Ownership and exclusion? Madam, you are living in the wrong country in the wrong century. I am ashamed that someone so narrow minded was quoted at the top of the article. As a member of a race persecuted for who they are since the written word could document it you should live the example of tolerance, not demand the opposite. Shame!

  • 199. CrankyPants wrote:

    Finally, your arguments might make an impact if they weren’t expressed in the language of a sixth grade child. Do none of you have an education regarding the language spoken in your country, much less spellcheck? And… all demands of a spiritual community should be enforced from within the community itself. These signs are likely considered an attack by those who are not a member of said community and may prejudice those readers against the posting community, and who wishes to encourage more intolerance in any community or the world?

  • 201. tznius with a shturm wrote:

    The arguments about the sign is off track its the tznius of our chabad women thats an issue maybe it should have been stressed not of the African-Americans. Its not their chiyuv

  • 202. America wrote:

    Sure, I wish people would dress better today. But it is America, most people, my family included, came to this country for freedom. You can have your religion, you can have your thoughts and beliefs and practice them without prejudice. However, you are in America, and you live in an American city. Not a Jewish city or an African American city or and Indian city. You can enforce your beliefs in your own home and your own church but not in the town. You can hang whatever kind of sign you want, it’s America and you get to do that!! What makes me sick, was not the sign, it was the comments and the thread. I had to double check that I was reading this correctly. The statements that have been made go against what America stands for. Do you ever wonder why there is such religious discrimination in this world? It’s because no one uses common sense!!! Have values!!!! Have morals!!! Be kind to one another!!! Respect one another!!! Respect each other’s beliefs but do not impose them on anyone else!! I am not Jewish, and I believe the Jewish people can believe what ever they want. Just remember, just because you live in a neighborhood it doesn’t make it yours. It is Crown Heights…America!!!

  • 204. Alison wrote:

    I wish people would dress modestly on main street in huntington beach. I choose not to go there because of the self-disrespect. Send us some of your signs, Crown Heights, i’m going to try to spread the tznius thing around here. I’m all for it!!

    Besides, the Rebbe urged this. So it’s highly appropriate for Crown Heights. I see nothing wrong with it. And I have one or two pairs of pants in my closet, but i still don’t feel the same when i wear them. :)

  • 205. Here's my thought wrote:

    The person’s point is well taken. (Unlike Christiainity) Judaism is supposedly not a religion of indoctrination and evangelization. So to each, his own. Jews appreciate tolerance I am sure. Furthermore, if these people with the offensive dress codes visited synagogue on shabbat, will they be welcome? I doubt it. I seriously doubt it. How far does this charitable attitude go?

  • 206. Anonymous wrote:

    What type of reaction would you have if you passed through a Muslim neighborhood (and there are plenty of them in the US) and saw signs asking people to dress modestly? Be honest about how you would react…and then ask yourself about your reaction to these signs

    Many people have posted about how strongly the Rebbe advocated tznius…yet there were never signs put up around the neighborhood with his name or approval attached to them (signs inside 770 are another story). I make no claim to understand the methodology of the Rebbe (and I am not connected to Chabad at all), but I am confident that the Rebbes approach was to focus on the positive elements as a motivator, not put up signs which imply that “people” are doing the wrong thing. Kiruv is not effective when it begins with a negative message. However politely these signs are written, they are definitely conveying a negative message to whomever their intended audience

    At the end of the day…who are these signs for? People that are nor Jewish are likely to ignore them at best. Jews that are already dressing in accordance with the signs will ignore them as well. Jews that are not dressed in accordance with the signs will either ignore them, or lash out.

    Real change is never accomplished through street signs. Street signs like these might be a “feel good” action, but they have never caused any real changes anywhere.

  • 207. Hillel Hazoken wrote:

    Fellow CH yidden,

    Tznius, while a very important mitzva, should not be a divisive issue. Do not do onto others (point out their faults, call names, argue in a rude fashion, etc.) what you would not done to yourself!

    Hillel

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