Posted to NYC News on
New York World

On the morning of October 12, Melissa Franchy boarded the B110 bus in Brooklyn and sat down near the front. For a few minutes she was left in silence, although the other passengers gave her a noticeably wide berth. But as the bus began to fill up, the men told her that she had to get up. Move to the back, they insisted.

NYC Bus Makes Women Ride in Back

New York World

On the morning of October 12, Melissa Franchy boarded the B110 bus in Brooklyn and sat down near the front. For a few minutes she was left in silence, although the other passengers gave her a noticeably wide berth. But as the bus began to fill up, the men told her that she had to get up. Move to the back, they insisted.

They were Orthodox Jews with full beards, sidecurls and long black coats, who told her that she was riding a “private bus” and a “Jewish bus.” When she asked why she had to move, a man scolded her.

“If God makes a rule, you don’t ask ‘Why make the rule?’” he told Franchy, who rode the bus at the invitation of a New York World reporter. She then moved to the back where the other women were sitting. The driver did not intervene in the incident.

The B110 bus travels between Williamsburg and Borough Park in Brooklyn. It is open to the public, and has a route number and tall blue bus stop signs like any other city bus. But the B110 operates according to its own distinct rules. The bus line is run by a private company and serves the Hasidic communities of the two neighborhoods. To avoid physical contact between members of opposite genders that is prohibited by Hasidic tradition, men sit in the front of the bus and women sit in the back.

The arrangement that the B110 operates under can only be described as unorthodox. It operates as a franchise, in which a private company, Private Transportation Corporation, pays the city for the right to provide a public service. Passengers pay their $2.50 fare not by MetroCard, but in dollar bills and coins. The city’s Franchise and Concession Review Committee defines a franchise on its website as “the right to occupy or to use the City’s inalienable property, such as streets or parks, for a public service, e.g., transportation.”

The agreement goes back to at least 1973, and last year the franchise paid the city $22,814 to operate the route, according to the New York City Department of Transportation. According to the news site Vos Iz Neias?, which serves the Orthodox Jewish community in New York City and elsewhere, the bus company has a board of consulting rabbis, which decreed that male passengers should ride in the front of the bus and female passengers in the back.

City, state and federal law all proscribe discrimination based on gender in public accommodations. “Discrimination in employment, housing and public accommodations in New York City is against the law,” said Betsy Herzog, a spokeswoman for the New York City Commission on Human Rights, which investigates and prosecutes alleged violations of anti-discrimination law.

The Department of Transportation, which issues the franchise, confirms that it understands the B110 to be subject to anti-discrimination laws. “This is a private company, but it is a public service,” said Seth Solomonow, a spokesman for the DOT. “The company has to comply with all applicable laws.”

Following the New York World’s inquiry, Solomonow said DOT would contact Private Transportation Corporation. “We are reaching out to the company about this alleged incident to ask for its response, with the expectation that it will take steps to prevent the occurrence of incidents of this nature,” he said.

Herzog said the Human Rights Commission would be unable to investigate the B110 unless someone filed a complaint. But its website states that “anyone who provides goods and services to the general public is considered a public accommodation” and that it illegal for public accommodations to “set different terms for obtaining those goods or services” to different groups.

Ross Sandler, a professor at New York Law School and editor of the CityLaw newsletter, said that anti-discrimination laws apply to bus franchises, but that religious groups are sometimes granted exceptions. “Do all these laws apply? Yes, they apply to buses that are franchises,” Sandler said. “The question is whether there is an exception for this particular bus line.”

The Transportation Department said that the B110 had not been granted any exceptions to anti-discrimination laws.

Calls to the offices of Private Transportation Corporation also went unreturned. We tried calling the home of Jacob Marmurstein, the company’s president, but were told he was unavailable.

The New York World will be keeping a close eye on the practices aboard the B110 bus and the city’s response – and we will let you know when we hear more.

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41 Comments

  • Ashamed

    This makes me sick to my stomach. If they do not want men and women sitting together make one side the bus for women and one side for men. DO not make it separated from back to front you stupid non showered womanizers!

  • STOP HERASSMENT OF JEWISH PEOPLE. LEAVE

    Chinese Chinatown dollar vans charge more than the MetroCard and take cash. They have signs saying no parking or something to that effect where they pick up in Flushing} South of the Flushing Long Island RailRoad station.

    They do not have the round signs.

    I cannot see someone complaining about a Chinese dollar van. They do not speak English}Mandarin Or Cantonese

    Maybe they can the run the buses in a better way with LESS GOVERNMENT INTERVENTION AND FEES.

    Tell them you do not speak English. Yiddish anyone?

    No complaint was made to the bus driver. PASSENGERS CAN *DEMAND* *WHATEVER THEY WANT FROM OTHER PASSENGERS* EVEN FEMALES TO MOVE TO THE BACK OF THE BUS. THE BUS DRIVER AND YIDDISHE BUSINESS WERE *NOT* INVOLVED. TELL THE GOYIM TO STOP MAKING TROUBLE FOR ANOTHER JEWISH BUSINESS

  • a loyal fan to ch.info

    why do you feel the need to take just about evey article that F> publishes that tries to give a bad name to the frum community? these articles are written by people going around who are anti chabad anti frum and alot of them ant Semites

    Soon they will write a article how we must have a mixed shul and so on. it will never end. you may get some more hits or comments but sometimes we need to stand for ourselves and not support people that SR and others vd”l

  • aliza a.

    I have this incredible desire to go ride that bus up and down the route in the very front of the bus – over and over again – the Rosa Parks of the orthodox world!
    I am all about tznius and acting in an appropriate manner but I think this is rude and over the top.

  • G-on Yaakov

    What is interesting is this woman rode the bus at the invitation of this “investigating” newspaper.

    Then they complained.

    Nobody who actually uses the bus has a problem with the set up.

    Why?

    Because in a community that actually puts a premium on Tznius, (just saying “I’m all about Tznius” is not enough) this is the only set up that makes sense. You have men and you have women. They must sit separately. One group has to be assigned to the front, and one to the back. And there is also a prohibition against men gazing upon women. So they put the women behind the men.

    So the modern, de-sensitized, immoralized (new word), falsely indignant world wants to pretend to be offended by this when there are real problems they could be fixing if their brains hadn’t fallen so far out of their self proclaimed “open-minds?” So what? That’s why a Jewish community with high standards should change its ways? That is the advice that CH.I readers and commenters have to give?

  • A mans tznius obligation

    “If God makes a rule, you don’t ask”

    In the true spirit of tznius men should wear horse blinders so their eyes wont stray.

  • kol hakavod!

    the rebbe once told a mechanech that we can learn tsniyus from the veltishe even more so from the chasidishe!
    kol hakavod to them for aranging such a beutiful thing!

  • MEN TO THE BACK

    I male and i say if these rabbis decree separation let the men sit in the back of the bus!

  • MEN TO THE BACK

    I male and i say if these rabbis decree separation let the men sit in the back of the bus!

  • sick of being embarassed

    This is disgusting…makes me ashamed to be a Jew. The Rebbe said we should live with the times…and there are certainly mor respectful ways to keep traditions that are not ignorant!

  • Milhouse

    #12 Have you never heard of shmiras einayim? Even if you personally aren’t careful with it, how did it become an alien concept to you? What kind of yiddishkeit, let alone chassidishkeit were you taught?

  • duh

    To number two…you’re and imbecile…the China vans are privately owned and don’t run on any public bus route they have the right to only speak Cantonese or mandarin and charge more. The bus in the article runs on city lines and is essentially a public bus! try getting your facts straight!

  • HALEVAI LUBAVITCH

    It makes me sick how we, Lubavitchers, have lowered our standards. The mingling seen in Tashlich and Simchas B’H. in Crown Heights are not seen in any other chassidic group. They have kept their levush, their language and tznius and their kashrus standards are higher than ours, and look were CH is now!!! How sad, we just bring tzoros to the Rebbe. Halevai we should send our women OR men to the back of the bus!

  • TO #18

    First of all you dont know who number 12 is. Maybe he was brought up differently than you.

    Why is a bus ride any different than sitting in a restaurant, walking down the street or shopping in a store?

    Thank you for being the one who creates the line as to where shmiras einayim is enforced and where it is not. Maybe the buses should be separate completely and have a mens bus and a womans bus? Who says a man getting on the bus doesn’t gaze back at the women before sitting down? Maybe we should make certain sides of the street for men and certain sides for women. Or better yet lets create specific hours of the day when men can walk down kingston and other hours where women can walk down kingston.

    My point is you clearly have no idea how far women have had to come socially in the last 300 years. A little more sensitivity to people’s feelings is also a part of being a good chassid. Especially a part of being a lubavitch chassid.

    At a certain point each individual has to stop themselves from letting their eyes wander towards things they shouldnt be staring at. Of course there has to be a fence from aveiros but not at the cost of making a woman feel inferior!

  • CH sunlight

    This article should not be on this site, Chabad is founded on tzniuth and harchakath znuth..

  • CH sunlight II

    the seder is for the women to able to see the men and not vice-versa (ezrath nashim in beith hamikdash is given standard).

  • YOU SADISTS!

    To my dear 5, 11, 15 and 16:

    You are all professional SADISTS!
    Don’t know what I’m talking about?
    Simple, what can be worse than torture
    of the mind?

  • The bottom line

    We seem to be forgetting the bottom line here.
    The reason for tznius laws is not to belittle
    or second class the women in any way, Chas V’Shalom.
    It is a barricade to help us refrain from SIN! Understand?
    This is not rocket science or esoteric psychology. It is
    plain and obvious, given human nature.

    Once we start compromising our standards of tznius,
    then it will be one compromise after the other,and
    it won’t be long before you couldn’t tell Crown Heights
    from Miami Beach. In fact, on SBH, I got a glimpse – couldn’t
    help it. She walked right in front of me – of some woman, who was not to far from beach attire. I couldn’t believe such a
    thing in CH. Is tznius regression becoming like an epidemic here?

  • Dovid

    This is a private bus. The problem here is the city via regulations makes it impossible for this to be considered a private and not public. Further the only people in which there would be a demand to go from Williamsburg and Boro Park are Chassidim. Regulations are how the state controls you.

  • Milhouse

    #15/16, if the men sit in the back then they’re looking at the women in the front.

    #17, how ignorant can you get? The Alter Rebbe said to live with the times, MEANING THE PARSHA OF THE WEEK. The Rebbe NEVER said to live with the contemporary morals!

    #22, if #12 was not brought up as a chossid then she or he needs to learn and raise her or his level, not demand that others lower themselves. All the examples you give would be good things, but there’s a limit to what is possible and practical. This separation on the bus is practical, as proven by the fact that it works. Separate buses would be a lot harder to do; maybe if there were enough demand that too could be done. But the ikkar is to be a mehalech, to always go up and improve, and never go down chas vesholom. If someone else is holding at a higher level than you, even a level that you don’t imagine yourself ever reaching, then you should admire him, not criticize him and try to bring him down!

  • CL outside CH

    We don’t know the whole story! This woman is probably not a Yid, she may not know our laws of tznius. The Chassid who asked the lady to move may not have been the nicest when asking her to have a seat with the rest of the women in the back of the bus or he could have been a wonderfully sweet to her. However he asked/told her to move she took it and ran with the “stereotype” that women are second class citizens in our world.Part of me also believes that whomever invited her on the bus did so knowing that she should sit with the women and still invited her to sit down with them hoping that someone would make a scene! I am sure the Rebbe would not have wanted this woman embarassed but educated on why we do what we do!!

  • Kari

    Seriously? Are we in the 1960’s ROSA PARKS!!!!!!!! this is my religion, but you are so backwards in your thinking.

  • Negativity needs to cease

    I have not been able to figure out why the same message about the separation of men and women can’t be communicated in a kind and civil manner. Is it certain men’s pleasure to be hostile, rude, cold, or disrespectful in how they speak to women? (or anyone who may not know their exact rules.) I don’t know what tone was used in this particular situation, but the article makes it sound to me that it was a very negative one. As has been stated, if this was a “plant”, then the article might be slanted to misrepresent the men that asked the woman to go to the back of the bus. But if it was not slanted, then I think the men need to learn respect and kindness when they explain their customs. Otherwise they look ignorant, and they do not represent Chabad, or themselves, or the Rebbe, or Moshiach in any appropriate way.

  • to milhouse

    Milhouse cant stop ignoring the fact that no one here disagrees with the need to be frum.

    People here disagree with the lack of feeling used when enforcing the frumkeit. The only reason the bus is capable of being enforced is because of the neighborhood they live in. It would not be capable here.

    Why dont you go picket outside the ohel bus and see who accepts you with open arms.

  • Milhouse

    #35, what lack of feeling? What on earth are you talking about? How do you know there is a lack of feeling? And what do you mean that it could not be done here? When I used to take the community bus between CH and BP it was always separate, and nobody had a problem with it. I haven’t taken it in years; does it even still exist? And if it does, is it now mixed? In any case, nobody is calling for this to be spread to places that are not shayach to it; instead people are attacking it in a community where it’s completely accepted and normal, and calling for the kedusha of that community to be degraded just to make them feel happy about their own lower level.

  • Anonymous

    Here we go again. It always “the men can’t look at the women-blah,blah,blah” as if women are never attracted to men.

  • Sorry but...

    Reminds me of those Monsey buses that have shower curtains as mechitzas.

    All as bad as each other.

  • SZ

    I liked the old Belemz busses in Israel. Men on one side, womeon on the other. It worked fine.

    The main problem I had with the mechitza busses is since I had no clue who’s on the other side it’s very easy to smack into someone on the other side of the mechitza which sort of misses the point.

  • Milhouse

    #37, you’re clearly an am ho’oretz. Yes, men looking at women is very different from women looking at men. Women looking at men is not a problem, for reasons that should be obvious.

  • yidel

    #1: sounds like you some serious ahavas yisrael (or sinas yisrael, really) issues. You bring new meaning to the saying, “we are our own worst enemies”. go get some hadracha from your rov