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Shomrim – Keepers Of The Peace

In this week’s “Mishpacha” Magazine an article was published about the organization and some of its history. You can click on the image of the article to get a larger and clearer view. The rest of it is in the Extended Article.



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40 Comments

  • Anonymous

    So are Shmira and Shomrim the same group? Why do they have two different phone numbers?

  • anonymous 3

    "In 1996, after much discussion, Crown Heights Shemirah organization made the tactical move to become "shomrim" as well" (p. 2)

    Yeah Right!

    maybe they should’ve used this line instead:
    "In 1996, after many fights, a core group of the Crown Heights Shemirah organization made the political move of forming the breakaway "shomrim".

    just trying to have some historical accuracy here…

  • Crown Heights- Booster

    Shmira and Shomin are in fact different. The NYPD does not trust Shmira, they trust Shomrim. But Shmira is affiliated with the CH JCC somehow.

  • from miami

    To Anonymous 3: For who ever knows , and if you remeber when the SHOMRIM update used to come out ,first it was shmirah update then after a few months it became shomrim update why? and this was before the whole shmirah shomrim issue came up ? B/c it is like it says in the article!.

  • esther

    to crown heights-booster:

    Ummm no offense but why would they NYPD not trust shmira. I mean, im not blaming them for not trusting them, but like still…wat does shomrim have that shmira doesn’t??

  • proud lubab

    it says nothing about crown heights being a lubavitch community. In fact I think they treid to hide this fact, Chuptzpa, of you are going to say something nice do it properly

  • anash member

    the cops like shomrim tooo much b/c shomrim lick their —. shomrim members are scared of the nypd and do what the nypd want instead of what is good for the community.

  • Anonymous

    anash member:

    Please read what you just wrote and try to understand it… “the cops like shomrim tooo much b/c shomrim lick their —. shomrim members are scared of the nypd and do what the nypd want instead of what is good for the community.”.

    Like a no name commenter said that 10 out of 14 shmira guys have a felony charge against them, I would say it’s because of what you say (if true). Which is absurd! Would you go and do opposite of what the police tell you?? In front of them? What benefit is that? That other “Anash Members” would have to go do the Mitzvah of Pidyon Shvuyim?

    There is a proper way of getting things done! Which can be what Shomrim is doing. Having a good relation with the NYPD and still getting the job done where is needed (Vedai Lamaivin) because the police will overlook certain things.

    And yes, any citizen should fear the law when they are breaking it, because they are no better then the other criminals when they cross the line, so dear anash member, what was the last thing you contributed back to the community?

  • from miami

    Webby right on! couldnt agree with you more!. Shomrim,s doin a great job, and it all starts from the top ! from the pepole who run it keep it up !

  • simple guy living in ch

    i have no clue aboyt shmira and shomrim but what i do know is that every time there is a call its shomrim who show up in seconds i never hear a story about shmira being there sounds to me shomrim is trying to keep ch safe the only thing i heard of shmira is that want are money

  • Shmuli

    well said Mr. ‘simple guy living in ch’

    from my personal experiance: (I’m one of those type of guys that try to call both Shmira and Shomrim as soon as something happens). Shomrim responders are there in minutes.

    Never, in the more than 20 times I called them did Shmira respond in under half an hour.

    but I think we must keep in mind that both Shmira and Shomrim have their good and l’havdil… members. And perhaps we should be careful not to put anyone down, but credit is only given where credit is due.

    Thank you to the entire Shomrim team for all you have done for me; you may not even know it because every time its some other member.

    I urge everyone who would like to donate to our security, to donate to the Crown Heights Shomrim. For some reason they don’t spend their time fundraising; we must therefore take the enitiative and donate.

  • miki

    shmuli:
    your 100% right, someone once started hitting my brother and we called shmira, and after about 5 minuts thay call back and ask us if we still need them.

    i’m not saying this always happens but i think shomrim is definently better.

  • Shmuli

    hey Shmuli, I don’t usualy like when people write in my name or with the same spelling as me. but I think you wrote your comment so nicely; I’m glad we have the same name.

  • Shmira vs Shomrim

    I’m not really all that involved in what goes on bet these two rival organizations. I can however recall back to the different times that I have had need for their help. I can say that of the three or four times I called Shmira, Once I had to call FIVE times just to get through(, I got an answering machine the first four)! Once I was told that they were responding immediately although I never saw them arrive. On another occasion I was told to call them back when the incident was in CH (obviously someone standing in front of Kehos walking toward Lincoln Pl. isn’t in CH)! I must mention though that they did show up once after about fifteen minutes to the scene of a mugging involving a group of thugs armed and using spay mace!

    Now I have no experience calling Shormim, although people I have spoken to never told me such horror stories about their service. Therefore I really shouldn’t be one to compare, I will however take the liberty to voice my own opinion.

    Everyone is titled to an opinion, and with the help of Shmiras previous responses I have formed mine. I need not tell you who I would call if C"V there was another incident in which I was involved. They claim they need more money for better communication systems, but the communications are never sent out to the members when no-one answers the phone! And when a CH member in distress right across the street from 770 is not help-able being that he isn’t in CH, i think twice before contributing.

    Whatever caused the split years ago is irrelevant to the way things run now. There are two separate organizations here, and one of them just seems to portray an image of securing our neighborhood, while the other looks like…….What’s important now is to understand who out there will help us when we need it, and who will cause problems. Whatever the reason, if the police show up at a scene and meet someone they just had a scuffle with yesterday, (who happens to a responding unit,) will it help or hurt the situation??

    Respecting, listening to, and working the police are NOT problems!! They are virtues which should be sought after!!

  • anonymous 3

    to from miami: i dont remember these shmirah / shomrim updates. what i do remember is that as far back as i can remember there was a "shmira" which was affiliated with the CHJCC. now there is a "shomrim" which is dis-affiliated (did i just make up a word?) from the CHJCC and an affiliated "shmira". i havent been following the politics, i really dont know what happened between then and now, if what i posted previously was incorrect i apologize.

    to webby: "10 out of 14 smirah guys have a felony charge ageist them"
    while i know absolutely nothing about this i’m going to give my own analysis and 2c:
    there are several issues here:
    1. do they have convictions or just had charges? (BIG differance there)
    2. were these charges shmira related? (that’s what the flow of this conversation seems to apply) if yes is that really a bad thing? my personal opinion is that when you catch these ******** you beat the **** out of them and dump them in some curb, not just turn them over to the cops where they’ll be back on the street the next day doing the same thing again. (obviously i’m not advocating acting stupidly, breaking the law in front of the cops’ faces, acting confrontational etc. all i’m saying is that [as you, webby, keep posting here] the cops are’nt doing a darn thing to protect us, we shouldn’t be shoving our noses up their behinds)
    3. how clean are the shomrim members? (i’m not talking about the new generation, all these kids who just joined recently. i’m talking about the older guys, the founding group) from what i remember they didnt exactly make a name for themselves of being the most law-abiding citizens. (not that 2 wrongs make a right. but maybe some people here are being a bit self righteous)
    as for this whole response time thing: b"h i’ve never had the need to call either one. i have however witnessed shmira responding to 2 incidents. while i dont know exactly how long it took for them to respond, i’m sure it wasnt long. (had they not responded quickly it would’ve been over long before it got there) while i’m in no way trying to say that they are perfect and always answer / respond right away, (as i said i’ve never had the "honor" of needing their "services") i do find it a bit odd that everyone that reads this site calls them so often and always have problems. sounds a bit suspicous to me.
    i personally think that both groups have the communitys interests at heart. i just wish they were able to work together instead of wasting their energies fighting each other…

  • from miami

    Tothe above article : You are right on the money ! I hope everyone would have that much sense, good job!

  • Anonymous

    I would like to take a moment and direct everyone’s attention to “anonymous 3’s” comment. Let’s take this one at a time.

    As I said in my comment on the alleged charges, it wasn’t me who is claiming this, it is another commenter who said this, so the whole thing becomes a moot point. So if you were to just really read my comment you would save yourself the need to write 40% of what you did.

    Next.

    You seem to make a big point of “being affiliated” and “not affiliated” with the CHJCC, why? What do they really do for us in terms of security? [side note: I will not knock C”V the wonderful help the woman there provide with food stamps and all other government aid programs, a lot of people would be lost without them.] But the way I see it is that they really don’t do anything for us, the elected “big wigs” are chasing after the politicians and not the commanding officers of the local precincts. When was the last time you heard of a meeting between the police department and our JCC?

    So let’s sum this up, the CHJCC dose absolutely nothing for out security and protection on the streets, so being affiliated with them isn’t really such a big deal. Right?

    Now on a side note, the Shomrim organization has a meeting once a month with the commanding brass of the 71st precinct, do you know how? There is a “precinct meeting” held once a month where I think it’s every residents duty to attend, and the Shomrim are there, be it just for good relations, they are there.

    So why do the Shomrim “shove their noses up their behinds”? Hmm that’s a real though one. Since the police/law do nothing about these criminals [yes, as I keep reporting], the next logical thing would be to take matters into our own hands, right? Wrong! What you do is you side step the police and make a bigger case out of it and step on their toes you make them look bad, but you do not go and break the law! You can’t enforce to law by breaking it, what good are you if you are just like the criminal who broke a car window, and you went and broke his bones, what difference are you two? [Don’t get me wrong I do believe in street justice, but no I won’t cross the line and do it]

    Now about wasting energies, I find what you say very funny. For the simple reason that you don’t see Shomrim going around collecting money for “communication equipment or necessary finances to operate” or going around giving out coffee mugs to gain public awareness. Now that’s what I call wasting energies, AND MONEY.

    And last but for sure not least, response times! As we all can see you are not sure yourself what the response times really are, you B”H did not have to call any group, and may you never have to. But as we can clearly see that other comments strongly contrast yours. Oh and not only the commenter’s are the readers of this site, you need to remember that there are a lot more readers out there that B”H did not have to call Shomrim thereby not seeing the need to comment.

    So to sum it up, you managed to wire this huge comment with little or no point to it. Congrats!

  • simple guy living in ch

    hey all
    yesterday i was walking down empire and saw a Jew getting a ticket by 2 black women cops
    i stood and watched when they were done they returned to the corner of Albany and empire and waited i saw many black people in cars on the phone and not wearing a seat belt but none of them were pulled over the first Jew that was not wearing a seat belt as pulled over i watched this for about 45 minutes this is crazy
    where is the CHJCC this is going on since tishrei so much Jewish money is going to the garbage because of these 2 anti Semites
    enough is enough if the CHJCC cant do anything the shomrim and shmira should and if they cant we should hold a protest at the 71st prescient and demand these 2 cops be moved far away from CH
    why is the community letting this happen
    they even rolled down the window and gave me comments when they saw i was watching them
    can we do something i would get 20 bochurim and stand in front of their car and block them
    webby maybe we can get photos of them on here

  • anonymous 3

    i’m not going to start going around in circles here. you have your views and i have mine.

    a couple of clarifications:
    1. the whole CHJCC thing: i didnt mean it at all to give any credit to them for doing anything for our security, in fact i personally think they arent doing much (if anything). especially now that its being run by a convicted felon (but thats a whole other issue) i was only using it in the context of whether or not the present shomrim is the same organization as the previous shmirah.

    2. i agree with you 100% about the precint meetings. more people definitely need to start attending (myself included -if i ever manage to actualy be in town when they happen)

    3. as for my not being sure about the response times: i wasn’t standing there with a stopwatch, but their response was definitely quick, definitely within minutes. is it possible that their 2 responses which i witnessed were the only 2 that they ever responded quickly to? i guess its possible but it seems rather unlikely to me.

  • from miami

    To anonymous 3 : what you have to know is that Shmirah then is shomrim now ,and another way of proving it is look who has the original shmirah number of 718-774-3333 if shomrim was the new group dont you think they would have to make a new hot-line? .what you say that when you catch theses crooks dump them in a back alley etc.. i personally agree with that but times have changed ,its not like it was 10 years ago ,so u have to go diplomatic . Also about the response time , I had a couple of friends actually 3 different instances where my friends told me they called and twice got an answering machine ! so there is truth there ,also thank G-D you never had to use any thats good to hear and hopefully it stays that way ! and what you mention in the end about working together hey peace is always good !

  • simple guy living in ch

    yeh i go to those meeting on empire we need everyone to come even for 5 minutes and sign in
    it will help for the election

  • another CH resident

    Crown Heights- Booster wrote:
    Shmira and Shomin are in fact different. The NYPD does not trust Shmira, they trust Shomrim. But Shmira is affiliated with the CH JCC somehow.
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~
    We now know why the Police Department and the council don’t talk!!! They don’t trust their cronies… besides for which, do you think the cops really want to sit down with Chanina and hear is bs?

  • barry b

    the guy that was watching the cops on empire its 100%
    true i was watching and circled with my car and saw the same thing only jews only jews!

  • simple guy living in ch

    so whats going to be ? are we all going to be quiet while these 2 sick women are taking are all money and having a good time on us? we have to stop this we need 20 people to stand by the car and not let her take off and run after others

  • anonymous 3

    "so whats going to be ? are we all going to be quiet while these 2 sick women are taking are all money and having a good time on us?"

    well obviously we are going to do what we always do: NOTHING! we are all just going to sit around and complain about it. (its either that or fight each other over who gets to do something about it)

    its time this community had some "leaders" who do something other than fight each other.

  • To anonymous 3 and the rest of CH

    "Well obviously we are going to do what we always do: NOTHING! We are all just going to sit around and complain about it."

    For starters why don’t we each start by doing our OWN LITTLE part right, before demanding of others to do their part. What I mean is simply that if you can’t do what you, as a frum Jew (who has a mitzvah to obey the national laws), and as a proper citizen have a civic (and halachic, [though maybe I shouldn’t go there, too many people might get upset that I’m mixing into their lives]) duty to do, then who gives you the right to complain that other people/organizations aren’t doing their part. Instead of complaining that we always sit around doing nothing and just complaining, (as you are doing at this very moment by writing these comments instead of acting on them,) why don’t YOU (and everyone else reading these comments) take action to stop this nonsense!!

    These "these 2 sick women [who] are taking are all [all our] money and having a good time on us", who just happen to be 2 New York Police Officers which risk their lives on a daily basis (just by wearing their uniform) in order to protect and uphold the standards of freedom and liberty that we so dearly live by, are doing a great service to the community!!

    —————————-

    Think back to the many incidents which have been reported on this as well as other news portals, (not to mention all those incidents that don’t even make it to the media,) which had vehicle related accidents, injuries, fatalities, as well as significant monetary damages.

    How many of those injuries would have been prevented, and how many lives saved, if all the parties involved would have been seated properly, WEARING THEIR SEATBELTS?!

    How many accidents could have prevented if the drivers involved were paying their full attention to the task of driving, as opposed to using one hand to hold their cell phone, while engaging in a mind distracting emotional/thought consuming phone conversation?!

    How many accidents could have been prevented, and how many lives saved if people DIDN’T put everybody else’s lives after their own immature personals whims by SPEEDING on narrow congested city roadways??!!!

    How many accidents could have been prevented, and how many lives saved if people would think rationally instead of TAKING RED LIGHTS assuming it would be of any help to them???!!!

    {Are the two minutes that you save by practicing all these crazy behaviors
    really worth the risk of putting yours as well as other peoples lives in danger???!!! When you speed up Kingston Avenue, do you really need to get to you destination 15 seconds earlier (because if you calculate it, the amount of time you save by speeding is so minimal, that if you rolled down your window to say hi to someone, {something we should all be doing a lot more often in this neighborhood, although I won’t even try to touch that topic now,} you would have just used up all the time you ‘saved’ through speeding, not putting on your seatbelt, taking that red light, and talking on your phone while turning the corner!!!}

    Think to yourselves the answers to these questions, and then tell me with a straight face and rational mind, (forget about the selfish feelings telling you that anyone giving you a fine is wrong and unwarranted,) that anyone who is doing ANYTHING (including, if need be, ticketing) the offending individuals to stop them from continuing on in these dangerous, selfish, immature, and stupid ways, is doing something wrong!! Anyone trying to stop these behaviors, even a police officer ticketing you, is doing the right thing, and is making it safer for all of us, our children, parents, friends and neighbors to walk and drive the streets of this country!!

    When an officer is trying to improve the safety of our streets by stopping these behaviors we should be so impressed that we walk over to them and say: "thank you for making this a safer place for me, my family, and community to live in"!! We should be complimenting the NYPD for actually doing something about our safety instead of complaining about it!!

    To be continued…

  • To anonymous 3 and the rst of CH cont...

    …Continued

    Now if it really is true that these police are only pulling over offending Jews while offending non-Jews are let to just roll right by, then we should take proper action by;
    1st documenting it, using videos or other means of evidence to show them pulling over Jews, while you have on tape the offending gentiles being allowed to drive right by without being stopped.
    2nd Approach the two officers (or their superiors, or both) showing them the video and demanding a valid explanation, and correction of the problem. (BTW correction of the problem does NOT mean that they stop giving out tickets, it means that they ticket every single offending vehicle, Jew and gentile alike!!)
    3rd If both these steps prove fruitless, You can then have a delegation approach the big brass in the precinct or higher and file an official discrimination complaint, leaving it very open to a follow-up lawsuit to take place.
    And finally if all else fails, maybe we need to take this to a higher level and actually file a discrimination lawsuit against the NYPD.

    ——————–

    But this is only after we each ourselves fix our portion of the problem!!

    Lets try, each one of us on our own to make this community a safer place to live by doing the following:

    Wear your seatbelt EVERY time you drive. Most fatal accidents happen close to home on those short trips to the grocery or school. Seatbelts increase your chance of surviving a fatal accident between 45%-60%. Air bags are not a substitute rather an accomplice of the seatbelt. An air bag without a seatbelt can kill you!!

    DON’T SPEED it can kill you a lot quicker than it can take you to your destination. Better be a minute late than DEAD on time!!

    DON’T TAKE RED LIGHTS it puts everyone’s’ including your life in danger. If you don’t care about your life, at least do the rest of us a favor and pretend to care about our lives.

    DON’T TALK ON YOUR CELL PHONE while driving. Driving is a difficult enough task as it is, you don’t need to make it harder and more risky by taking your mind off the task at hand through involving your brain, and the hand holding the phone in a conversation. If it’s really that important let the person call you back, and if it can’t wait, pull over, talk to them, and when you finish continue driving.

    If we each took these steps to minimize our risk of injury, and that of those people around us, for starters we’d be in a much safer community, and secondly the cops would NOT BE ABLE to ticket us, even they looked into every Jewish car that drove past!!!
    Seat belt data … http://www.dps.state.mn.us/…

  • 2 THE LAST 2 COMMENTS

    IM NOT SURE WHERE TO BEGIN WITH YOU
    NOBODY IS SAYING THE COPS DONT DO A GOOD JOB WE ALL RESPECT THEM TONS AND WE ADMIRE THEM FOR THE WORK THEY DO
    THESE 2 COPS ARE NOT LIKE THE REST OF THEM THEY ARE ANTI SEMITES WE HAVE IT ON VEDIO THEY ARE JEW HATers THEY GAVE ME COMMENTS AND THEY GAVE MANY PEOPLE COMMENTS THAT ARE RACIAL
    OF COURSE WE ALL AGREE YOU HAVE TO WEAR A SEAT BELT ON NOT BE ON THE PHONE BUT ITS THE WAY THEY DO IT
    THEY ARE NOT DOING IT TO TRY TO MAKE OUR STREETS SAFER WHILE GIRLS ARE BEING RAPED ON THE STRETS OF CH AND GUYS ARE BEING BEATON EVERY DAY CARS ARE BEING BROKEN INTO
    THESE COPS DONT CARE THEY JUST WANT TO HAMMER THE JEWISH PEOPLE AND GO HOME LAUGHING AT US
    ENOUGH IS ENOUGH WE NEED 10-20 PEOPLE WHO ARE WILLING TO GO AND STAND UP AND DO WHATS RIGHT
    ITS ABOUT TIME TO PUT THESE COPS IN THEIR PLACE

  • the last 2 comments

    I’d like to clarify a few points here.

    First of all — I agree (as I mentioned at the end of my comment) that if they are being anti-Semitic they should definitely be dealt with appropriately. If you have a video, USE IT, show to the right people and take care of them.

    Second of all — In my comment I was answering a specific point mentioned in the comment before it. The point of my comment is the quote I brought in the beginning. And that doesn’t mean I don’t agree with the other necessary safety issues etc., I just wasn’t discussing them.

    Third of all — I never said THEY are doing it to make the streets safer, however I was addressing the issue of the way the residents of CH drive around as if life has no meaning to them, and if they C"V hit someone it wouldn’t really matter.

    To explain:
    The quote I’ll repeat was; "Well obviously we are going to do what we always do: NOTHING! We are all just going to sit around and complain about it."

    My point was (and is) that there is something we can do about it, and that is to drive safely around the area. A bi-product of driving safely and responsibly around CH would be safer streets, as well as not giving "these 2 cops" something to ticket us for.

    I feel that the way people drive around here is putting every single member and visitor of our community in danger, and I wanted to stress that point.

    And yes as I said before, we do need to do something about this, however it should done the right way.

  • anonymous 3

    to "the last 2 comments"

    i was in no way advocating driving unsafely or recklessly or without seatbelts. (cell phones is a whole other issue -i’m not going to get into that now) obviously everyone should be driving safely.

    i was referring to the anti-semetic actions of these 2 officers. apparantly you agree with me on that issue so i think you could’ve wrote your whole safety post without attacking me…
    i actualy wrote a post saying to do practicaly the same thing that you said (in not nearly as many words) but for some reason it never made it through.

  • the last 2 comments

    to "anonymous 3"

    "well obviously we are going to do what we always do: NOTHING! we are all just going to sit around and complain about it. (its either that or fight each other over who gets to do something about it)"

    I was just giving you a few examples of things YOU could do as an individual to change things.

    Including driving safely and reporting them to higher officials in the precinct.

  • anonymous 3

    "well obviously we <b>ARE</b> going to do what we always do: NOTHING!"

    i never said we cant do anything, i said we wont do anything, just like we always do nothing.

    obviously if we all drive with seatbelts and dont talk on the phone they cant give us tickets for it.
    thats not the point. the point wasnt how to prevent us from getting tickets when we disobey the law. the point was what to do about the anti-semetic actions of these 2 officers. imho (assuming all the allegations are true) if no jews would be driving without seatbelts or talking on cell phones they would probably be driving around CH looking for illegaly parked cars etc.

    as for what we SHOULD do about it, as i said in my last post, i said basically the same thing you said. and as for reporting them to the higher ups, according to that article in the CH Chronicle, they complained to the higher ups and were basically told to go to hell.