CROWN HEIGHTS, Brooklyn [CHI] — This past Motzoai Shabbos Parashas Beshalach, after Marriv in 770 mispalelim stepped out to recite Kiddush Levana following which a group began singing and dancing and one Rabbi, Yekutiel Rapp was giving out Lechaim, and was issues a Criminal Court Summons for distributing alcohol in the street and for possession of an open alcohol container on the street, both of which are criminal misdemeanor offences.
More in the Extended Article.
Rabbi Issued C-Summons for Giving out Alcohol
CROWN HEIGHTS, Brooklyn [CHI] — This past Motzoai Shabbos Parashas Beshalach, after Marriv in 770 mispalelim stepped out to recite Kiddush Levana following which a group began singing and dancing and one Rabbi, Yekutiel Rapp was giving out Lechaim, and was issues a Criminal Court Summons for distributing alcohol in the street and for possession of an open alcohol container on the street, both of which are criminal misdemeanor offences.
More in the Extended Article.
According to people who observed the incident said a police officer who was manning the police command post, which is parked in front of 770, approached Rabbi Rapp and asked him to stop diving out alcohol in public and walked away. A short while later the police officer returned and saw him still giving out alcohol he issues him the Criminal Court Summons.
An ‘open container’ summons carries a maximum fine of up to $100 and is considered a petty offense which may or may not carry a criminal record.
Zalman
BH
I feel for rabbi Rapp and his family, but maybe with this happening, hashgacha pratis.
It is time in my mind, that we should know our self’s and our children should know that drinking Mashke, saying l’chayim, is not the ikar, and not even the Taffel, it is a thing that is done from time to time every now and then at a farbrengen, it is a practice that our rabbeyim did NOT like.
there was a time that when ever you would come into 770 during mairiv you would see kutty rapp handing out mashke to all, even young kids while the tzfattie group would be jumping up and down, genug mit di shtussim, if a summens and a chillul hashem is the way this could be stopped, nu zul zain.
Question
Question: What is the purpose of this story?
Answer: Just pure gossip aka loshon hara.
???
Give me a break!!
The policeman was not tipped of?
It was a policeman innocently fulfilling his line of duty??
CH
That’s so sad.
Don’t start saying that it’s wrong that he gives it out…don’t look for lashon hara to say!
moshiach now!
mt
a shande di loshon horo
its so sad to see how many articles are based on alcohol probs.
give out mezonos’l, or maybe some juice, why schnapps?
yagan time
this is going to go down as modern day mesiras nefesh in the tzfati year book, what a joke!!
Milhouse
There’s nothing wrong with giving lechayim, but why do it right in front of a policeman? And if a policeman asked him nicely to stop, he should have had the sechel to stop at least until that cop was no longer on duty! Or he should have stepped inside the 770 property line, so he wouldn’t be on the street any longer! A bissel sechel darf men hoben!
Chanina
he should have been locked up years ago.
It-s worth a shot
He can argue his behavior is protected by the First Amendment’s free exercise of religion clause.
Aaron Minkowitz
He was not dispensing alchol. he was giving Lechayim
Keep on doing it and he should ask the cop if he could get a seasons ticket
Lechayim
Me
He should not be doing it. There are laws and he should follow them.
Concerned Yid
This would be clear violation of religious liberty- even during prohibition, the law allowed alcohol to be produced for religious purposes.
GROW UP!!!
YAY!
All the Anti’s can slap themselves on the back!!!
A Concerned Mother
Why didn’t Pellin win?
Because of our children.
And this story is just one more indication of why things are hard.
We need more Mesibee Shabbes.
Anti-....booze
I’m slappin’! I’m slappin’!
He’s an idiot with an ego almost as wide as he is. Why provoke trouble?
LH
WHOA WORSE THAN THIS ARTICLE BEING LOSHON HARA IS THE COMMENTS!!! please a little ahavas yisroel people
Milhouse
Why should he follow the laws? What authority do the laws have? Where is it written that one must follow the laws? (Yes, I am serious; find me where it is written that there is an obligation on any person to obey whatever the legislature says. You won’t find it, because it’s not there.)
Hilchos Beis Habechirah
Sadly, Rabbi Rapp has no constitutional protection for serving alcohol in the street. The constitution allows for state infringement on the free exercise of religion where the laws being enforced are neutral (i.e., non-discriminatory) and serve a compelling state interest.
New York State has a compelling interest to keep alcohol from being served in the street and the law is neutral – it does not target Jewish practices specifically, rather it is a law that bans all open alcohol from being served by anybody.
Furthermore, there is no established Jewish religious practice to drink in the streets to begin with.
Let Rabbi Rapp have his day in court …
Dershowitz
To Hilchos Beis Habechirah, The accused is presumed innocent. Was the bottle seized as evidence to ascertain its contents were alcoholic? Was the contents analyized by a laboratory to establish the alcohol content? Until there is actual proof of an offence, these are only bare allegations.
leib
Its ta’ke not right to give out alcohol in the street, but why do all those comments have to sound so negetive against him?
Did he do anything bad to YOU?
what laws?
In response to: “”Why should he follow the laws? What authority do the laws have? Where is it written that one must follow the laws?“””
Sir, your comments portray a brilliance which surpasses the brightest of men. I’ve got a sudden urge to rob a bank, create a Ponzi scheme of my own, and run through every red light my ’83 Chevy Nova can get its wheels through while inebriated with a bottle of Jack Daniels.
Laws are truly useless, and I think that they should be eliminated through the Fairness Doctrine. Oh shucks, Dina D’Malchus Dina–I guess the bank can keep its cash after all.
is your head filled with air?
happy? crownheights.info if there’s another yiddishe death, it’s on your shoulders.
Dr. Brian Griffin
To What law:
Meet me at the comer of Kingston and Eastern Parkway at 12Am sharp! I have a plan!
To Milhouse:
Aren’t you looking forward to having your house robbed and you car broken in to? that would be a reasonable society.
shmendrik
it is 100% assur to drink anything before making havdallah.
im not a lubavitcher, but i think the mishna berurah brings down the shulchan aruch harav on this one.
matter of fact, there is no heter at all.
period.
Marbim bsimcha?
It’s less than a month to Purim. Hope people take a lesson from this.
Duh
To “It-s worth a shot
So if my religion requires me to murder people will I be protected under the ”First Amendment’s free exercise…”??
bimkom she-ein anashim, hishtadel lihyos
Lol, People are so dumb and foolish, its really sad!
What’s with bad mouthing another yid for doing something wrong, have some self dignity and keep ur infantile comments to yourselves, whether you hold that drinking l’chaim is correct or not, whether you like tzfati’s or not.
And to the mishna brura genius, sorry to pop ur bubble but kiddush levana is done only after havdalla
Sick!
The fact that crownheights.info even post some of the above comments is sick in itself!
moishie
He was 100% wrong! It belongs inside as the law says and not also it should not be distributed to minors.
If you don’t like the laws vote for someone that will change them otherwise OBEY THE LAWS!
Whats the big deal?
So what its gonna cost $100 and thats it, why make such a big deal?
c.l.
Rabbi Rap is a sincere chasidishe mentch maybe the action could have been provented but dont make him look bad.
T S
I like “Dershowitz’s” post. Would be a nice loophole.
Though
1. I disagree with doling out alchohol in public
2. I wonder if he was doling to a minor,
3. calling booze “l’chaim” does not sanitize the problems it creates and includes
4. to continue doing something after a cop tells you to stop must be thought through thoroughly if the potential pain outweighs the gain
I still would love Rapp toget off the hook completely using the argument – where is the proof that the liquid was alchohol? Did the cop taste it or assumed by the bottle what the contents were? (Rapp might have to lie if asked what the contents were though)..
Milhouse
Moishie, you keep repeating that, but why should we obey the laws? Just because you say so?
“What laws?” and “Dr. Brian Griffin” would have us believe that robbery and fraud are only wrong because there happen to be laws against them? And if the legislature were to legalise them they’d be OK? You’ve got it completely backwards. Robbery and murder were wrong long before any laws existed, and they’d be wrong if all laws disappeared tomorrow. Governments are created among men in order to safeguard the inalienable rights with which we are ENDOWED BY OUR CREATOR. When they make laws punishing wrongdoing, they are fulfilling their function; when they fail to make such laws, or when they make laws punishing things that are NOT wrong, then they are failing in their function. But either way a person must be guided by what is right, not by what is legal. Wrong is wrong even if there’s no law against it, and right is right even if there is a law against it. Laws have no moral authority whatsoever, and there is no obligation, moral or halachic, to obey them.
L-Chaim B-Yerushalayim!!
wats with all the lashon hara? keep ur opinions to urself … the bais hamikdash was destroyed because of Sinas Chinam and it will be rebuilt with ahavas chinam … its a year of Hakhel … unite and let go of all ur egos
L’Chaim B’Yerushalayim!!
bd
please everyone, i agree with the nizkar leeil comment that worse then the article is the comments
STOP LOSHON HORO! ur just getting more and more sins on yourself
WHY ch.info do you post these? dont please!
as for my opinion, i agree with ‘mt’ that he ould have given out otehr things, buy 20 bottles of juice and tons of cups and give that to all the thirsty bochurim or whoever. why alcohol? just because yyou call it lechaim that makes it kosher? this is where addiction to alcohol starts… with only 1 drop…
H.A.H.
lol look at how many comments this article got… all those dormant commenters suddenly ‘wake up’ when they smell a chance to say loshon hora.
HAVE A HEART
Me
This is Kuty Rapp’s smallest offense. How about what he is doing in the Yeshivah? He is part of the destruction. Let him take all his bottles and sit under a rock with them.
Hilchos Beis Habechirah
Dershowitz: you are plainly wrong about a presumption of innocence. On the contrary, there is a rebuttable presumption of a violation. This violation is a civil ordinance, not a criminal case. Deference is given to the police officer giving the ticket who makes a reasonable assumption based on “the totality of circumstances.” The assumption is reasonable when the open container has the insignia of an alcoholic beverage. If Rabbi Rapp was pouring clear liquid out of a Smirnoff bottle, a police officer would be right to issue a summons. I have the relevant law if you are interested.
While this presumption may be rebutted, it would be a terrible strategy where the cost of the fine is only about $25 and there is enormous potential for steeper fines and excessive legal fees by challenging the charge, particularly where Rabbi Rapp was, in fact, doling out alcohol, and probably to minors.
It-s worth a shot
To Duh:
Perhaps I can explain it to you. How would you feel if police officers gave you and every other couple that marries in front of 770 Eastern Parkway a criminal court summons at their wedding, when the wine is drunk outside in front of 770 as part of the ceremony? Would you still compare the legality of drinking alcohol in public to murder, or would you argue it was your right, protected by the 1st Amendment to the U.S. Constitution to have the wine drunk in front of 770 as part of a Jewish religious ceremony? So if Rabbi Rapp feels l’chaim is an integral part of a religious kiddush levanah ceremony, it is well argued that this giving of l’chaim is protected by the 1st Amendment – and every right thinking person in Crown Heights should either support Rabbi Rapp’s defense or get married indoors.
laughing
To
CL, WE aren’t making him look bad. He’s doing it all by himself. And very well too, I must say!
sz
i may not agree with the man. but this a chutzpa to put such a article in the reshus harabim about a person what if it were your parents. and all the other loshon hara, of the comments. this is sick disgusting dispicible makes one throw up sick faint how can you just write about particular people in the resus harabim like that. again i dont agree with him, but this is horrible and infuriating.
Milhouse
bd writes: “this is where addiction to alcohol starts… with only 1 drop”
bd, if you would have people abstain completely from alcohol then you are not a Jew, and certainly not a chossid. Alcohol is a blessing from Hashem, and a good thing. Like all good things, it’s best in moderation. The Rebbe said that mashkeh is like mei maayon, it’s metaher bemashehu — but that mashehu is vital! You sound like someone who would tell people to take a shower instead of going to mikveh.
And no, juice would NOT be an adequate substitute; do you think he was giving lechayim because people were thirsty? Or that a tiny kelishke would be enough to slake anyone’s thirst? So why do you suggest that? The whole point of taking mashke is for the effect of the alcohol, which promotes simcha. The posuk says veyayin yesamach levav enosh, and Chazal tell us ein simcha ela beyayin.
Still, once the cop had warned him he should have stopped, at least until that cop went away, or else moved onto private property.
Zookeeper
Never disturb coffee break in a mobile police lounge. Even if it’s parked right on your lawn.
Dershowitz
Hilchos Beis Habechirah: A misdemeanor is an offence, not merely a civil ordinance, and as such all the elements of the offence must be proven on a standard beyon a reasonable doubt. (In a civil ordinance the standard is on the balance of probabilities). Get a refund on your law school tuition. Many would defend such charges probono. AD
hey!
hey genius with your
“shulchan aruch harav and ”mishna brura, check other sfarum and maaayybe youll find out that he probably made havdalah
Hilchos Beis Habechirah
Dershowitz: unfortunately naivete is not something that you can pay for, otherwise I would recommend that you go beg for a refund.
CH.info got it wrong. The NYC “open container” law is a civil ordinance, not a criminal offense. It is not found in the Criminal Code, it is in the NYC Administrative Code, sec. 10-125. If its context were not telling of its civil nature, sec. 10-125(e) clarifies that it is a civil ordinance: “Any person who shall be found to have violated any of the provisions of this section shall be liable for a CIVIL penalty . . . ” (emphasis added)
shlucha
Can comments be banned?? What’s their use except machlokes anyhow? Gott knows we don’t need any more of that.
Dershowitz
Hilchos Beis Habechirah: Nearly all regulatory offences are not found in the criminal code, yet are treated as “quasi-criminal” and a prima facie case must be proven beyond a reasonable doubt.
Although a finding of guilt can be based on inferences, they must be more than merely circumstantial.
In application: If the officer gives evidence that the liquid smelled of alcohol, an inference can be found that the liquid was alcohol.
However, observing the pouring a liquid from an alcoholic bottle (by itself) does not create the evidential inference that the liquid was indeed alcohol. AD
Kuti Krapp
Kuti Krapp is a Shoyte.