160 Comments

• Enough

  Enough communism!!! Chabad fought the KGB and then adapts it’s ways? Yes, I have a lot of issues with what Rabbi Boteach says, but to close my ears and shut out a fellow Lubavitcher who by the way still considers the Rebbe to be his motivation? This is SINAS CHINUM, jealousy… Don’t like him? Don’t invite him. But to bash a veteran shliach like Rabbi Goldman is unacceptable!!! Shame on you!!!

  • Boteach a Lubavitcher

    Seriously?? He may think he is a chosid…he also thinks he’s America’s Rabbi, so…

  • you said more than enough

    What a hypocrite you are!

    You can say what you want but the Rosh is not allowed…

    You dont have to listen to the Rosh (though – in my opinion – dont call yourself Chabad if you are not ready to listen to people like the Rosh).

  • Milhouse

    That depends. If you merely have issues with him, then you should hear what he has to say, and judge it for yourself, and let others do the same. But if what he has to say is “against Torah and Halacha” then surely it’s forbidden to hear him. Surely you know that yiddishkeit does not believe in free speech, any more than it does in free food. There are many things it is forbidden to read, or to hear, just as there are many things it’s forbidden to eat.

    This is the first I’ve heard that R Boteach’s views are in this category, but that doesn’t automatically make it incorrect. If the Rosh has done the necessary chakirah udrishah and has discovered solid evidence to back up what he says, then he’s right to make this psak, which should be regarded in exactly the same way as a psak that a particular product is treif, or a particular mikveh is possul.

  • CHLEAKS.COM

    To #1

    in my shul they say the following to those who claim “democracy” (those who challenge the leadership ) …

    “Our shul is like Cuba, the only difference is, in Cuba you can’t leave, here (our shul) you can leave whenever you want”.

    Exit Question: are you counted in the 90% of so called Lubavitchers that (used his democracy) to go to the call of the shofer?

  • Just Sayin

    The Rosh isn’t coming out of the blue with this. When Shmuly came out with his latest book, the Rosh’s brother, Rabbi Dr. Immanuel Schochet zt’l, came out and called Shmuly’s book straight up apikursos. Considering they are (were) both amongst the greatest scholars in Chabad, I think they have a right to express what is and isn’t allowed. For Rabbi Goldman to ignore those who are vastly more knowledgeable than he is and bring down SB anyway is unacceptable for a “verteran shliach”.

  • YMSP

    There’s a difference between ahavas Yisroel and allowing someone to spread poisonous standards barabim. When it affects the klal there’s an obligation to stand up against it, including mitzad ahavas yisroel. The Rebbe did this many times.

    There’s also an obligation to keep one’s mind pure. If people who want philosophy would read the Tzemach Tzedek’s Sefer Chakira instead of Boteach’s fluff, they’d be smarter and the world would be a better place.

• Sao Paulo

  The last true Chossid….

  • Mabin es pnei chaveroi...!! Hate is worse than "Provocative" Hafatza tactics!

    Ragzonim and Jew bashers were always against the Rebbe’s (chessed) chassidus approach!

    i’d rather be guilty of “Provocative” Haftaza tactics… than be a hate mongering leader, always looking to put other yidden down! -Hamalbin es pnei Chavero…!!!

    if you have aggression issues (Angry genes) get help!

    dont use Torah as a clever front to express your unresolved aggression!

    if you (your family has a need for heated aggression) deal with it privately in therapy, instead of “Malbin es pnei Chaveroi Borabim!

    wrap your personality issues and lust for Aggression in the name

  • Kop Mentch

    This previous commentator forgot to take his medication before sending the comment. He is howling at the moon.

    The commentator’s warped mind sees others as aggressors and therefore reacts aggressively by attacking. He starts simple with name calling (“Ragzonim and Jew bashers”) and continues with more name calling (“hate mongering leader”). He then tries to insult the entire family of his target (“your family has a need for heated aggression)”.

    The previous commentator should take his meds immediately. Right now he sounds like a rabid dog howling at the moon.

  • Ex-COTS

    To: Mabin es pnei chaveroi…!! Hate is worse than “Provocative” Hafatza tactics!

    You sound like you went to COTS and are upset at the guy who took down your Cult Leader.

    You tipped us off when you wrote, “deal with it privately in therapy”.

    Are you hurting so bad that COTS was exposed?!

  • YOEC alumnus

    talk about aggression. Pot calling the kettle black. And it sure seems that YOU are a great therapy candidate.

• The Rosh says it like it is!

  If “The Rosh” would be in the Litvish world – he would be a Gadol. We are lucky to have him in Chabad. The Rosh speaks EMES because Torah IS emes!! He says it like it is. If you can’t handle the truth – live the lie but at least don’t shlep others into it.

  • Chabad=yeshivish not my Chabad

    So Chabad is now modeling itself on the yeshivish world? Is that what Chabad has come to? It is so very very sad.

  • Chabad

    “Chabad=yeshivish not my Chabad”, Chabad models itself after halacha and Torah (it this we agree with the Yeshivish world), it that is not your Chabad, I suggest you identify yourself with Conservative or Reform Judasim.

  • Chabad=yeshivish not my Chabad

    @Chabad: I certainly don’t identify myself with people that judge other people – especially without knowing them.
    “Judge every person favorably” (Avos 1:6)
    “Do not judge your fellow until you have stood in his place.” (Avos 2:5)

    I guess you were out when they taught this.

  • Chabad=yeshivish not my Chabad

    And i guess you must miss the posuk it is proper to say right after we put on Tefillin “I accept upon myself the mitzvah to love my fellow Jew like myself”

  • YMSP

    Don’t know why the same people who are bending over backwards to make connections with the modern-orthodox (which the Rebbe called “di neieh conservative” when they were a lot more in line than they are now), are the same people who want to separate Chabad from the yeshiva world.
    When someone asked about “Bnai Brak” and his milchomo against the Rebbe, the Rebbe answered how it’s not from here and pointed out how the Rebbe Rashab worked with R’ Chaim Ozer Gorodetsky and R’ Chaim Brisker.

    To say that Chabad has no connection to the Litvish world means that one does not know what Chabad is. There are for sure people in that world who make up new Torahs and think that every crazy thought that falls into their head is Torah miSinai. But we have that among our own scoundrels too.

    Lakewood’s “chodosh osur min haTorah” is today in line with Chabad fighting to uphold Torah. Many Litvisher Roshei Yeshiva learn chassidus or at least the Rebbe’s biurim. Many are selfless marbitzei Torah, including to the not yet frum, without changing Torah (Aish has its problems but there are much more ehrlich organizations). When Reb Shraga Faivel Mendlowitz he set out selflessly teaching Torah and changed thousands. He would learn chassidus, quoted the Alter Rebbe, and when one of his talmidim forgot a fal in a Chabad niggun that represented 4 olemos, he said how “we didn’t reach Atzilus.” He worked with Chazzan Yossele Rosenblatt to found Dos Yiddishe Licht, a newspaper that was lochem against the same shul rabbis that the Frierdiker Rebbe and then the Rebbe screamed against, who btw were the forerunners of the modern orthodox loons of today, and everything the Rebbeim pointed out about them is true today.

    Chabad fights for Torah and works with others who do. The same people criticizing the entire Litvisher world are the same who seek to make a connection with the Modern-Orthodox loons who are mehares ikrei hadaas, who reinvent standards of kashrus, who don’t know or care what bitul Torah is or what a Jew should think or be involved in, who engage in crazy activism, promote hirus haolom under the name of “tolerance,” and destroy families by rallying for gittin on demand, keneged halacha. There’s a big push within some – some – of anash to connect with them in very unhealthy ways. It’s 100% against what the Rebbe’s clear Sichos and writings state. Chabad is part of the Torah world, in fact it’s the lead marbitz Torah. Reb Shraga Faivel Mendlowitz’s selfless devotion to spreading Torah without compromise paved the way for ehrlicher yeshivos in America and brought thousands back to Torah. The Rebbe, as a neshomo klalis and the Debar HaDor, brought back millions. It’s the same work though.

• ch.info stirring machlokes!

  How can you post this before you have allowed r. Goldman to comment!
  Please remove this, wait until after shabbos, and let him weigh in!
  All this will do is encourage loshin horah and machlokes in crown heights and throughout the world. Rabbi goldman is an ehrliche yid.
  This is WRONG!!!!!

  • K

    It is long past shabbos and Goldman is silent. Yet the program with Boteach continues. Goldman marches to his own drummer and that drummer is not the Torah M’sinai.

• Give boteach money

  If you gave shmuly the right amount of money to wear a cross he would do so and he has proven that over and over again

  • Mabin es pnei chaveroi...!!

    your approach is not just against chabad, its against Torah!!

    do tshuvah!

    i love Rabbi Boteach, even though i disagree with some of his “publicity” tactics

    only bitter, jealous people like you engage in such vile Jew against Jew sinaa!

  • Ex-COTS

    The Rosh was “good enough” to expose COTS but you question his “right” (obligation) to expose Boteach?!

    I suspect that ALL those who write against the Rosh are FORMER COTS PARTICIPANTS who are STILL “under the influence”.

    This is their way of “getting back” at the one who took down their Cult “leader”.

  • K

    To: Mabin es pnei chaveroi

    You wrote, “i love Rabbi Boteach”

    Do you love him enough to sell your soul and disgrace the name of Chabad and your revered Rebbe?!

• common sense

  Thank you Rabbi Shochet for standing up for the Truth!!

  • NOTHING DISGRACES THE REBBE MORE

    Than, well known Ragzonim, with a looong history of rageful outbursts ususally directed at other jews he disagrees with.

    even if RSB’s “publicity tactics” cross the line, (i think they do), this is no excuse for Known-Ragzonim, with temperamental issues, to indulge in their perverse lust for shaiming and being mevayesh fellow yidden and their families!

    please don’t suddenly feel bad for the Rosh for being exposed worse than those he attacks and shames,
    why worse?
    because stirring up machloikis and gleefully slaughtering fellow yidden in this way is far worse than RSB’s publicity-shtick

    this promulgation of SInaa between jews is way way worse than the most provocative book titles in the world!

• Shocking

  I am shocked that such a revered man like Rabbi Goldman could do this. And the titles of the lectures taking place in his shul are shocking. Look at Rabbi Goldman’s website: http://www.sydshul.co.za

  What have we come to? How can this go on without all the Rabbonim being up in arms about it?

• Alone in the desert

  And where are all the other Rabonim? Do they all approve Boteach? Why isRosh the only one speaking up?

  • obvious

    Because the Rosh is the only one with backbone. He does what is right, even if it’s not politically, financially, or religiously expedient. Who else speaks out for kovod Lubavitch? Certainly not Boteach, King of Sleaze.

• the rosh

  is always right on

• Check out goldmans website.

  http://www.sydshul.co.za

  And this is AFTER he said he is toning it down, HAVE WE NO SHAME?

• The Rosh?

  If anyone but the Rosh would be saying this I would not take it seriously.
  The Rosh happens to be the standard bearer for Lubavitch today.

  Period.

  • Milhouse

    I agree. If it were almost anyone else I would ignore it. But the Rosh’s opinion can’t be ignored; he’s far from infallible, but his opinion deserves respect and consideration, because he’s far more likely to be right than wrong.

• #1

  YOU DON’T KNOW WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT. S. BOTEACH WAS EXCOMMUNICATED AS A SHLIACH MANY YEARS AGO BY RABBI NACHMAN TZUDAK, WHILE HE WAS STILL AT OXFORD UNIVERSITY. BOTEACH HAS NO PROBLEMS KISSING OTHER WOMEN WHO ARE TOTALLY UNRELATED TO HIM, THIS IS SOMETHING I HAVE WITNESSED WITH MY OWN EYES. FOR A SHLIACH TO GIVE HIM THIS HONOR IS EXACTLY AS THE ROSH PUT IT. RABBI GOLDMAN SHOULD MAYBE STEP DOWN HIMSELF IF HE ALREADY FORGOT WHO SENT HIM THERE, AND SUSTAINED HIM ALL THESE YEARS. HE SHOULD HIDE HIS FACE IN SHAME!!!!!!!!

• sour grapes

  oh great here goes the sour comments – well guess what?
  when the rosh solves all the other problems we all got he can climb all over smuli.
  What trash talk!

  Nice how you guys found this out first ;)

  • K

    Kosher Yoshkeh ain’t “sour grapes”, it is vintage apikursus. The Rosh spoke out against COTS, that is child’s play compared to Boteachism.

• Well

  When Rabbi Kaduri spoke people listened so why allow this shliach speak!!!

• Let's call a spade spade!

  Re#1: A veteran Shliach who does not mind to go against the Rebbe and commit tremendous Chilul Hashem and Chilul Shem Lubavitch despite all the pleadings and warnings is NO SHLIACH!

• emes

  chabad fought the KGB with the emes of Torah.
  Boteach changes halacha and makes his own hashgafas which are morphed from the original halacha. He is off the path, and although its extreme to say what # 4 said, I can’t help but see some truth in it.

• There is a boss

  As much as i agree that Rabbi Shmuly is off the mark on too many issues since when is chabad in the Banning business?!

  Lets leave the banning to those who are in the banning business here are a few of the latest bans.

  Phoneline news updates,web,facebook, what’s up, makeup, penguin dancing the list goes on

  • K

    “Rabbi” Shmuly wrote a book called Kosher Yoshkeh, also Kosher Giluy Aroyos – he must be banned from leading astray people, certainly not to allow him o speak at frum venues..

• Target market

  Rabbi Goldman is not an idiot, he has a largely secular congregation and whomever he brings to speak to them has to be the right fit in order for them to relate to the speaker and not just view and listen to them as ‘just another Rabbi’, but someone who can address the issues of the modern Jew.

  Most rabbis are too afraid to even say the word, but Boteach has the courage to come out and break the ‘taboos’ and although he causes controversy, what he does is necessary.
  There is a reason Rabbi Goldman doesn’t bring out Rabbi Schochet to speak to his congregation.

  • K

    You wrote, “There is a reason Rabbi Goldman doesn’t bring out Rabbi Schochet to speak to his congregation.”

    Yep, because the Rosh did not write a book called Kosher Yoshkeh or Kosher Giluy Arayos.

  • Give the people what they want

    So let me get it straight – if the “largely secular congregation” would want breakfast of bacon and eggs, it would be okay to give it to them?!

    Serving bacon might be the “right fit in order for them to relate” to them but would you think it is okay?!

    It would take “courage” for a shul to serve bacon and “break the taboos” – and you think this is right?!

    Serving bacon has less of a problem than Kosher Yoshka!

• Wow!

  For the Rosh to criticize Rabbi Shmuly Boteach is quiet interesting. Shmuly is a graduate of the Rosh’s yeshiva …one of the more frum ones at that! How many graduates of Ohr Elchonan have strayed from the right path? I would love to hear the Rosh address that.

  • former talmid of YOEC

    Boteach is NOT one of the frummer talmidim. Was it Obama or Cory Booker who taught you to lie so causally?

  • Mottel

    Hundreds of shluchim around the world count themselves as the Rosh’s talmidim. Please.

  • Takes achrayus

    If indeed Boteach was a former talmid, it makes perfect sense that The Rosh should speak out against him.

    The Rosh, more than anyone else, knows what a mashchis and maysis u’mediach and choteh u’machti Boteach is!

  • me

    # 45.
    As I was in OEC myself, and have stayed on the right path.
    were do you come up with the “news flash” that SB was one of the more frum ones?? What A good Bull story!
    I know SB for years talked with him and argued points with him to avail.
    Get real, I trust the “rosh” more then SB anytime any place any topic any day.

• Ohev Sholom

  Responding to Nr 1 who says enough with communism!:
  Communism is forcing others to live based on their ideology. Nobody in Chabad is forcing you not to listen to SB. If you like his risque and idolatrous topics nobody is stopping you. It is sad and I would daven foryou, but ultimately it’s a free world and nobody in Chabad will stop you. So no communism to talk of.
  But, you don’t dare dictate to Chabad what we ought to tolerate in the name of Chabad and the Rebbe!!! What chutzpah! What nerve! No, there is zero tolerance in Chabad (as by all frum Jews) for sanctifying coarse loodness or for ‘kashering’ Yoshke (!!!).
  Either you’re a frum Jew or not, but keep your chutzpah, and stupidity I might add, to yourself!

• The Rebbe was a good judge of character

  Anyone who learns Chassidus and is mekushar to the Rebbe would not write or say negative things about other Jews. The Rebbe would not tolerate this.
  Be careful, before you ask Hashem to judge your words and actions!

  • Uh?

    “the Rebbe would not write or say negative things about other Jews”

    Are you kidding me?! The Rebbe would publicly scream at farbrengens to protest against other Jews who are hurting Yiddishkeit or misleading other Yidden, even if they were considered gedolim, like Rav Shach.

• The Rebbe would not have approved of loshon harah

  If we are trying to bring Moshiach this is not the way to do it. Let’s be positive about good that is being done in the world, instead of condemning Yidden, and especially fellow Chabad shluchim.

  • K

    Expose S. Botaech to be a reincarnation of Elisha ben Abuyah אלישע בן אבויה, a.k.a. Acher:

    He taught R’ Meir Torah, even was among the four who entered the Pardes ( Hagigah 14b)

    However, like S.B., he was a student of Greek; as the Talmud expresses it, “Acher’s tongue was never tired of singing Greek songs” (Jerusalem Talmud, Megillah i. 9). The Talmud suggests that his study of Greek philosophy was one of the factors that led him to apostasy (Hagigah 15b).

    Like S.B., while he was in the beth midrash he kept forbidden books hidden in his clothes (Hagigah 15b).

    Acher was a heretic and so is SB!!

  • Milhouse

    לאפרושי מאיסורא is not loshon hora.

• To # 1

  It is a shame that your American values by far outweigh your Torah values.
  Halacha is NOT democracy, and Halacha clearly dictates what we may read, listen too, even where we may walk.
  Sorry to break the news to you, but while in Lubavitch we welcome everyone, that does not mean we (are allowed to) give a platform to those same people.
  I’ll trust the Rosh over any anon writer, and many named people any day.

• 770

  Isn’t Rabbi Goldman a brother in law of Rabbi Kotlarsky?

  May I make a suggestion? If Rabbi Goldman feels the need to bring out speakers that talks the way shmulyb does, than perhaps he should a) ask a rov first, and b) bring a gutter yid and not necasserally a “Lubavitcher”….. After all, he might be a shliach but his shul is far from a beis chabad in the literal sence vda”l.

• Shaliach in South Africa

  It is astounding that a Rosh Yeshiva in LA has nothing better to do, and such little regard for a prominent Shaliach and all the Halachic questions of public defamation and humiliation involved in this biased letter. The posting by your website at a time when clearly no-one in South Africa could be reached for comment is mischievous to say the least!
  While Rabbi Goldman is quite capable of defending himself, I feel it is necessary to point out that he has done more for Yiddishkeit in South Africa over the past four decades than most will ever accomplish. His commitment to The Rebbe, the ethos of Chabad etc. is exemplary. To be vilified by a Californian Rosh Yeshiva, your website and many of the viscious comments posted here, is something I’m sure you all will have to answer for one day, and clearly, in my humble opinion, not the way The Rebbe expected his Chassidim to behave.

  • Milhouse

    You are not talking about s not stam “a rosh yeshivah”. In such a case you would be correct. But here you are talking about one of the greatest talmidei chachomim of this generation, so I think his opinion counts for a lot more than that of “a prominent shliach”, no matter how successful he has been. Success in hafotzas hamaayonos does not give someone authority; torah knowledge does. It could be that in this matter Rabbi Goldman is right and the Rosh is wrong, but that’s not the way to bet.

  • K

    “The Rosh” is respected even among the greatest Litvish-Yeshivish Rabbonim. His reputation as a an Adam-Godol is literally world wide. In many ways, if he would outside of Chabad he would have a greater impact on the Toraah leadership of Klal Yisroel.

    You wrote, “not the way The Rebbe expected his Chassidim to behave.” WRONG! The Rebbe also spoke out many times when he was displeased, and rightfully so! A true Talmid Chochom MUST speak out when he sees a wrong! The Rebbe himself protested PUBLICLY and demanded his chassidim to do so too!

    You write, “It is astounding that a Rosh Yeshiva in LA has nothing better to do.” Indeed, it is an OBLIGATION to speak out and there IS nothing more important than that!

    Since when do frum Yidden consider a Halachic ruling as “To be vilified by a Californian Rosh Yeshiva”? If he told you that a food item is trief or a certain action is chillul shabbos – would you say he “vilified” you or rather, that he gave you “guidance”?!

  • K #40

    Respected in the litvish yeshivish world, I am not lubavitch and learn in the Mir, I asked 15 people if the ever heard of the “Rosh”. Hate to burst your bubble though no one did. What I do think is before dealing with minute issues like Boteach, deal with what’s happening in Eretz yisroel, the entire Torah world is going crazy and the hanhala of Chabad is preoccupied with much more minor issues.

  • K

    I learn in BMG kollel (15 years), you learn in Mir (I assume EY). In America the Rosh is highly respected among my chaverim, Rabbonim in LA and many other locations. He is known as a bokie in shas and poskim plus a charif. But even in EY ask by the older Briskers about him – he is legendary.

  • Tomim

    To K #40,

    You learn in Mir and asked 15 guys if they heard of the Rosh and no one di. Interesting! Don’t you guys at Mir know that the Rosh is printed in the back of the Gemarah?! Are you guys in Yeshiva Mir or the Russian Space Station Mir???

• TO 20. There is a boss

  if the food was questionable kashrus would you serve it?
  If someone is speaking and its not the way of the Rebbe, do you put him up there to represent Chabad?

• Sruly Clapman

  I love Shmuly Boteach and I respect the Rosh so I can’t comment on what the clear answer is. However it’s very hard to Asser something based on emotions.

  Rabbi Shuchat as the dean of a Yeshiva can tell a Bocher not to attended. For him to Asser a rabbi 10,000 miles away from bringing a guest lecturer on a Sunday evening ?!?!!

  • K

    Are you saying that a Rov cannot pasken heter or issur if he is 10,000 miles away?! Does a Rov need to be within dalad amos before he can pasken?!

    Are you saying that there is a difference when the guest lecturer is speaking – that he cannot assur the speaker from presenting on a Sunday evening?!

    On what grounds have you based your decision that this proclamation of issur is based on “emotion”?

    The Rosh did not write that SB is ossur “because I don’t like him – that is how I feel”, rather he clearly wrote that it is ossur to listen to him “since his views on many issues are against Torah and Halacha”!

    Does that sound like it is “based on emotions”?!

    You wrote that you “respect the Rosh” – in what way? Clearly you don’t respect his halachic opinion! Are you a greater ben-Torah than he is?!

• Ch

  #23)… What does being a teacher have to do what one does after they leave his school ?? Are you trying to say or are you saying that because people stray away from the religion that were in his school after they leave is the Rosh’s fault ??? .. If you can prove because of the Rosh’s people left then I agree .. Though to blame the Rosh’s because they went through his doors … Sorry I disagree

• i admire the ROSH for taking a stand!

  its so comforting to know there are people out there who fight for whats right!!
  a shliach bringing in a low-life who calls himself ‘rabbi’ is not a personal issue- its a chabad issue and for a shliach- who is the REBBE’s rep bringing in someone like this- we should ALL protest. shame on some shluchim who forget who sent them and whom they represent!!!

  if you are a shliach you responsible that every word you spread reflects the Rebbes teachings- and if someone isnt- in the name of lubavitch it needs to be publicised by others. this is way more of a personal ‘loshon hara’ issue stop being so narrow-minded and ‘liberal’. since when does chabad ‘live and let live’ when its against torah?????

• boruch

  Rabbi goldman and rabbi shochet are both known to be very upstanding people,i have no oppinion on this matter,and neither shoud anybody judge them

  • "Upstanding" has nothing to do with it

    You wrote, ” both known to be very upstanding people” -is that how you decide halacha questions?

    The Rov and the janitor are both “upstanding people”, the rov says this food is trief, the janitor says it is kosher…hmmm, “i have no opinion on this matter,and neither should anybody judge them”

    Pure wisdom! Maybe be like Salomon, half the food is kosher and half is trief.

• Anonymous

  This might be why we have so many problems in Lubavitch, especiaaly with our youth. The lack of basic Derech Eretz for our Rabbonim, Roshei Yeshiva, and Mashpiim is mind-numbing. To see people address the Rosh with the chutzpa and lack of kovod that is displayed in these comments is all you need to know. The same was on display when the whole COTS issue was being discussed. It was shameful.

  To have such lack of kovod and lack of bittul for someone like the Rosh as well as all of our other fine chassidishe rabbonim and masshpiim might explain why we are experiencing so many problems in Lubavtich. We have effectively taught them and modeled for them how we don’t need to accept anyone’s opinion and guidance and no one knows anything and that we don’t need to listen to anyone whose opinion we disagree with. The results are tragically very evident.

  We can’t have it both ways: Talk, write, and act with heder hakovoid and chutzpa about and towards our spiritual leaders and at the same time expect our children to grow up fineh, eidele, frumeh, chassidishe Yidden. It doesn’t work that way.

  It’s time for a serious attitude change.

• rosh rosh

  the rosh should stick to his backyard.

  shmuly has more than enough to sell and although controversial, yes quite, he at least is doing outreach work while some of us are sitting on our tushies typing dumb comments.

  We have lots of issues to deal with – most of us simply do NOTHING to help any given situation. You can’t have teinos here.

  • K

    The reason why we have “lots of issues to deal with” is because we lack leadership. The Rosh is a leader and is giving leadership. While you are the one “sitting on your tushies typing dumb comments.” Use your “tushies” to sit and learn – then you will have the ounce of sechel to listen to The Rosh who is a huge ben-Torah!

  • rosh rosh

    you my friend are a perfect example of what I categorized…just run along and find a job now ;)

    How pathetic.

    And to add further – no one has the right to sit and judge other shluchim from their beach chairs including you K!

    Absolutely NO ONE!

  • SHMULLY DOES NOT DO OUTREACH

    Outreach is when you reach out to someone to be mikarev them. Show me someone who is putting on Tefilin because of Shmully?

    Michael Jackson? He’s dead. Corey Booker? He’s not Jewish. The moneybags? Give me your money not your soul.

  • Uh?

    You wrote, “no one has the right to sit and judge other shluchim from their beach chairs” – great cliché!

    The Rosh happens to be a shaliach too! Yet here YOU are judging him!

    Therefore you must be a “no one” because “no one has the right to sit and judge other shluchim”!

• It must be some kind of mistake!

  Prominent shliach of Rabbi Goldman caliber invites someone like Shmuley as a guest speaker? You got to be kidding! Why are you publishing unproven and unverified information? If such bizarre thing would be true, then leading Chabad Rabbonim from Europe, Israel and US would have been up in arms!!! People, don’t you realize, that it must be some kind pathetic misunderstanding?!?! If it would be true, we would not hear a lonely voice of Rav Schochet, but a squall of indignation from senior shluchim, mashpiim and rabbonim. But there are none!

  • K

    No mistake! We wish it were a mistake but it ISN’T!!

    It is on the website:
    http://www.sydshul.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=83&Itemid=145

    “Rabbi Shmuley Boteach the famous, outspoken author and speaker, who makes his home in New Jersey, will deliver the sermon tomorrow on Friday night, 21 February in the Main Shul. And then he will be addressing a Young Adults Dinner on Friday night 21 February here at Shul. His subject there is Love or Lust? A Guide to Healthy Relationships. Bookings are now closed and there are some 200 young people who will be attending.”

    “On Sunday night 23 February, Rabbi Shmuley will no doubt captivate the crowds as he explores Intriguing Intimacy. What does the Torah say about the Intimate Relationship?”

    “In case you don’t know, Rabbi Shmuley Boteach was dubbed by Newsweek “the most famous Rabbi in America.” The Jerusalem Post lists him as one of the “50 most influential Jews in the world.” His 29 best-selling books have been translated into 20 languages and he has appeared on America’s most watched TV shows including Oprah, Dr Phil, The Today Show, and The View. He is regarded as nothing less than a Relationships Guru.”

  • yanki

    Thats takkeh not a mistake. There were some other explicit texts in the website before shabbos, and they were rightfully removed.

• Stop the Loshon hora

  Chèvre……this discussion is in violation of Jewish law.
  All the people that are so indignant of Jewish law, should realise that speaking about another Jew in this way is far more prohibited than bringing a questionable guest

  • K

    It is a mitzvah to expose those who do not follow halacha, expecially when violations are done in public.

  • a questionable guest?

    This isn’t “a questionable guest”! This isn’t a shaylah or a sofek. This is a TRIEF guest. The Rosh paskened! Dvar Hashem zu halacha!

• Kosher J

  Three years ago this Apikorus wrote a Book Kosher Yoshke. Since then he has spoken in Church’s and left reformed places on this subject and unfortunately sold many of this Apikursos. If I remember correctly, Rabbi Yitzchok Wolf, a respected Mechanech exposed this Apikorus to the public. I guess That R Goldman does not use the internet or he just likes controversy. Either way for Gassen Yungen to criticize the Rosh for taking a stand is like telling a Posek, Shutuo we do not want to hear your Psak. That is fine join your friends who are without Yiras Shomayim, who care less about Chassidic Hanhoga and peddle your apikursos to others.

• A Little Reminder

  It was more than a year ago when the other esteemed Rabbi Schochet zt”l came out and slammed SB book. These are the great men in Lubavitch and they call it like they see it. These men were highly regarded by the Rebbe and I believe that when they call it as they see it, the rest of Lubavitch needs to stand up and take notice.

  Rabbi Goldman may be a wonderful shlich and may not have necessarily had a formulated opinion on Boteach the titles of his chosen talks notwithstanding. But now that Rabbi Schochet has come out with his proclamation it behoves Rabbi Goldman to bite the humble bullet and call off the talks. That would send out a strong message that (a) In Lubavitch we have sufficient humility still to acknowledge mistakes and to yield to authority greater than our own self-importance. And (b) that Boteach is what he is and once and for all, that should be acknowledge in Chabad. For too long he has been trying to play it both ways. You cannot kosher Je**us and peddle sex however kosher and still want to lay claim to being Chabad.

  Now let’s see if Goldman will step up to the plate. Make us proud Yossi.

• Yossi Chicago

  What most commentators fail to comprehend is that Rabbi Goldman is the rov, but also has a board and committees to work with. He is employed by the shul, unlike a typical Chabad House shliach that calls the shots himself and has the final word.

  I am shocked that anyone could judge a venerable rov like Rabbi Goldman without knowing the why and how the shul decided to bring Shmuley Boteach. Do you know who was behind it? Perhaps Rabbi Goldman felt this was not a battle worth fighting? Shul politics are very complicated.

  It is disgusting that a bunch of “arm chair” readers,with no understanding of the community and shul in SA, sit here cast judgement on a fellow chossid.

  • K

    If Goldman “couldn’t” fight this battle and was forced into this, then he should be GRATEFUL that Chabad condemns it!

    He should be thrilled that others stood up where he could not.

    It would vindicate his “resistance” to the board – if such a scenario is true (which I doubt).

  • prominent and venerable

    How does one attain these titles? By being the RaMaK’s brother in law or by wearing a tilted hat???

• Dont second-guess shluchim!

  All you critics, let me ask you one simple question: whom has the Rebbe sent to Johannesburg? You, me, Shmerl, Berl, Rabbi Schochet or may be actually Rabbi Goldman? Who are we to judge shluchim actions? Just because it may appear that they are doing something wrong, who are we to decide? When will we learn to trust shluchim in the choices and decisions they make?

  • K

    You ask, “When will we learn to trust shluchim in the choices and decisions they make?”

    Answer, “When they follow Rabbonim / Halacha / Da’as Torah. Not when they follow the desires of their own hearts.”

• fullheartedly agree with # 48

  everyone who has their huge opinions, keep them to yourselves before slamming R’ Goldman before knowing the facts.

  • K

    If you want the “facts;, check Goldman’s website:

    http://www.sydshul.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=83&Itemid=145

    Boteach spoke shabbos and will also speak on Sunday.

    On Friday night he spoke about “Love or Lust? A Guide to Healthy Relationships. Bookings are now closed and there are some 200 young people who will be attending.”

    On Sunday he will “explore Intriguing Intimacy. What does the Torah say about the Intimate Relationship?”

    THOSE ARE THE FACTS THAT ARE NEBECH PUBLICIZED ON THE CHABAD WEBSITE!

  • Numbers are out of wack.

    I wrote the above in response to #80, which use to be #48..

• ABSURD!

  I am not a fan of RSB but to ban people from hearing him speak is absurd. He is, after all, a fellow Jew, an educated one at that. You may not agree with him but to try to prohibit others from even hearing him speak reminds me of what the misnagdim tried to do 300 years ago.

  Not only that, but RSB thrives on controversy. This will only serve to make people more interested in him.

  Also, we have dialogues with our Conservative and Reform Jewish brethren. Is RSB’s message that much more controversial???

  • SHMULLY DOES NOT DO OUTREACH

    SB (I leave out the R because I don’t know if he got semicha but either way he is kineged halacha)

    He portrays himself as Chabad. Every few years he tries to clamor back. There was that famous Jerusalem Post article entitled Coming Home in which he tried to step back into Chabad. There was the other one where he spoke of his daughter wanting to go on shlichus etc. Then the Rosh brother, the legendary Rabbi Dr. JI Schochet z”l slammed him for his new book Kosher Jebus. That set SB back ten years in his ongoing crawl back into Chabad. He reacted emotionally violently at the time threatening to sue websites etc.

    He wants to have his came and eat it and looking to get hosted by Chabad shluchim is just another effort in that ploy.

    So, yes, hosting him is worse than hosting reform, though both are wrong. But with reform you know where you stand. With SB, der chazer veist di kosher fiselech.

  • Kosher Yoshkeh

    You wrote, “He is, after all, a fellow Jew, an educated one at that. You may not agree with him but to try to prohibit others from even hearing him speak…”

    Indeed, Boteach is a “fellow Jew” – just like Yoshkeh was. In fact Boteach “kashered” Yoshkeh and ADMIRES him.

    Would you allow Yoshkeh to preach in your shul? Maybe you would, but the Orthodox members would protest loudly.

  • Uh?

    “to ban people from hearing him speak is absurd. He is, after all, a fellow Jew, an educated one at that.”

    so…ANY fellow Jew, especially an “educated” one, can speak whatever heresy.

    There are many “educated” Reform “Rabbis” or University Professors who are true apikorsim.

    You think it is “absurd” to ban people from hearing them?!

• no.52

  dont second guess shluchim?? maybe i shouldn’t second guess carlebach went he was doing ‘shlichus’ work and kissing women? you’re gna tell me we only disagree with what he did as the rebbe told him to stop?? NO it’s clearly wrong and so is rabbi boteach being brought down who says things against Halacha!!

• Meihaichan Dantuni

  Nothing in this story indicated that Rabbi Shochet even attempted to speak to Rabbi Goldman about his opinion. Would it not be the minimum expected of a “mentch”?

  Rabbi Goldman, a Shliach and Rav who dedicated 40 years of his life working for the Rebbe deserves at least that much respect.

  But alas, this is Lubavitch today. One Rav slamming another Rav and the whole world reading and laughing at us. Shame on Crownheights.info for promoting this kind of Machlokes. Did anyone stop to think about the effect this kind of bashing has on the South African Jewish communities view of Chabad and the Rebbe’s Shluchim there??? This is the height of irresponsible “journalism”!.

  If Rabbi Shochet really wanted to be effective AND respect other Rabbonim (as I am sure he expects to be respected) he should have called Rabbi Goldman like a mentch.

  I’m sure Rabbo Shochet did not one day wake up and decide to find out what is going on in South Africa, Unfortunately, there are people who make it their business to be in everyone else’s business who incited him to write the “shameful” words that he did.

  If Rabbi Shochet is the great man that people describe, he would apologize to Rabbi Goldman for the defamation of his fine reputation.

  Dear Rabbi Shochet, call the Rabbi in South Africa and talk to him, don’t blast this kind of crap all over the open internet.

  Shame!

  • You make no sense!

    You start with an ASSUMPTION which has no foundation in reality and then build in mid-air a building and end by trying to charge rent to the imaginary tenants.

    You begin by saying, “Nothing in this story indicated that Rabbi Shochet even attempted to speak to Rabbi Goldman about his opinion.”

    The ‘story” (actually a letter) is 6 lines long, but since YOU do not see the background, you assume that there was no attempt to speak to Goldman.

    From this ASSUMPTION you CONCLUDE that Rabbi Schochet is not a mentch! As you write, “Would it not be the minimum expected of a “mentch”?”

    Then you build on the basis of your FALSE assumptions and conclusions to rant against Lubavitch and the Rosh.

    Then you end with a demand that The Rosh should apologize for acting as you ASSUME!

    The first three letters of ASSUME describe you.

  • Milhouse

    You write as if the Rosh and Rabbi Goldman are equals. If they were you’d be right. But they’re not.

• TorahYid

  Rav Boteach is kosher.

  • TorahYid

    So will pig be when Moshiach comes. Until then don’t be fooled by his split hooves.

  • Kosher

    He is as “Kosher” as Yoshkeh.

• to 48

  no…bringing a guest who will spread apikorsus in the name of CHABAD and the Rebbe is FAR WORSE!!!!

  you honestly think the Rebbe sat back when something was against torah so as not to offend anyone?????

  please, our Rebbeim were a little stronger than that when it came to spreading Torah PROPERLY. they did not shy away from admonishing if something was wrong!!

  thank you to the Rosh for standing up for the Rebbe!!!!

• to #44

  You speak about a lack of kavod for our Rabonim.I live in Los Angelas and I can tell you that this lack of kavod is in many ways brought about by some of the Rabonim themselves. It’s great to know chasidus and gemorah backwards and forwards but basic menchlichkait is even more important.

• HaMalbin es pnei chaveroi...!!

  Ragzonim and Jew bashers was always the exact opposite of our Rebbe’s (chessed) chassidus approach!

  i’d rather be guilty of “Provocative” Haftaza tactics… -as Boteach is- than bto e a hate mongering “leader” always looking to put other yidden down! -Hamalbin es pnei Chavero… EIN LO CHELEK!!!!!!

  To All Shochtim -and hot blooded temperholics- if you have aggression issues (Angry genes) etc, Go get the help you need!

  Dont put a bad taste in the mouth of our youth and communities just bec you relish machlokis!

  dont (mis)use Torah as a clever front to express your perverse lust for Aggression!

  if you (your family) have a craving for aggression, deal with it privately in therapy! on on the public stage at the expense of Sholom in our community!

  theres nothing worse than “Malbin es pnei Chaveroi Borabim!!

  • Rabid dog

    Did you skip taking your medication? You are howling at the moon.

    You complain about “HaMalbin es pnei chaveroi” while drooling spit as you call names “Ragzonim and Jew bashers, hate mongering, hot blooded temperholics etc” – a fine display of mania.

    You suggest that other need therapy for aggression – look in a mirror, while we listen to you howling at the moon.

  • Officer, I swear to drunk I am not G-d

    Yankel, did you run out of your meds again? Stop howling at the moon like a rabit dog and wipe the drool off your face.

• the rebbe' SPEECH

  the REBBE NEVER IN ANY OF HIS FARBRENGENS EVER ADMONISHED OR REBUKED ANY JEW BY NAME EVEN WHEN IT WAS ABOUT THE FOUNDATIONS OF TORAH + YIDDISHKEIT I.E. MIHU YEHUDI….ETC..WHERE IS THE “ZEHIRUS” OF THE “LAAV”–lai siso oluv chate.? AREN’T THERE RESPONSIBILTIES OF REBUKE THAT LAYS ON A BAIS DIN IN SPECIFIC TO DO AND NOT ANY ONE ROV CAN DECIDE ON HIS OWN TO DO….WHERE IS V.R.L.? WHERE IS DARCHEI NOAM? CHASSIDUS? DID WE EMBRACE THE SHITAH OF KANOIM? WILLIAMSBURG?

  • Do not disrespect the Rebbe

    Do not disrespect the Rebbe by claiming that he did not speak out against people (Yidden) who were destructive to yiddishkeit!

    The Rebbe was frum and kept halacha and did as mandated by shulchon aruch to speak out publicly against such people.

    It isn’t a “Williamsberg” or Kanoin shitta – but one of Toras Moshe! Either you agree with it or reject it, that is your bechira, but admit that is what the Rebbe did and as demanded in Torah.

    It is disrespectful that you write falsehoods about the Rebbe, claiming that he did not follow the Torah, simply because you do not agree with that portion of the Torah.

• this is the heart of a failing Chabad

  So many kulas and outright breaking of halacha has been done in the shlichus, it has left Chabad a shel of what it once was.

  Someone here asks “how can we judge a shliach?”. There is no shliach that would openly flaunt a psak halachah. If Rabbi Goldman knew his place, he would cancel or come out openly and say this was a board decision that my own rabonim cannot accept. Since when did a shliach become above a posek or mashpia? Maybe next year make the kinnus in Sochi and Shabbos wouldn’t be that big of a problem either.

• YAD CHASSIDIM

  It is never too late. Do teshuva shmully and all will be forgiven. But until you stop kissing and hugging women and writing pornography, I am afraid to say, you won’t be accepted.

• CH INFO V COWARD COL

  They don’t have the guts to publish the story? They are afraid of lawsuits?

  I see they took down their lead story of Rabbi JI Schochet a”h when he blasted Boteach over the Kosher J book.

  Message to Ceitlin and the other whacks at COL. You are cowards and you are losing credibility for being selective.

  CH Info keep breaking stories like this. Stay on top of your game and kill off COL. They have already dropped in viewings and many are seeing them now for the joke they are.

• If we had a rov

  If we had a rov like rabbi schochet in crown Heights we would be better off today he says it how it is he’s not afraid of the back lash how many people are mosrim in our neighborhood did you ever here a rov in ch throw them out of shul or call them out do you know how many people have stop work orders on there house from there Jewish neighbors or even worse have sent a Jewish to jail I salute rabbi schochet

  • Milhouse

    Unfortunately, if the Rosh were to be so foolish as to accept a rabbonus in Crown Heights, within a short time half the community would be cursing him just as they do every other rov….

• :(

  People are so quick to jump to conclusions.
  So enthusiastic to fan the flames of animosity.

  Sick. Sick. Sick

• To #62 and #67

  Some are obviously misunderstanding #48. Number 48 is clearly standing up for the Rosh and his kovod. Perhaps the numbers on the comments have shifted since last night. I think they did. What now appears as comment #48 last night showed up originally as #39. So something shifted. That might be why #62 and #67 are writing what they are writing. They are probably referring to what may have been #48 before the numbers shifted. As the numbers stand now, #62 and #67 can’t possibly be referring to the current #48.

  • Comical and very sad!!!

    You are right. The numbers did shift, that’s why nothing makes sense.

• shliah to Europe

  There is a reason why they’re not published an answer of Goldman, I saw it… it’s a letter to shluchim.. r”l! He better should NOT say what he sad… busha veherpa!! And that’s a “prominent ” shliah.. you should Not see it, I like the idea of “emunas shluhim”(more than emunas hahomim )I know myself things that’s I done against haloha and b”H it’s not gone public (not much chilul Hashem,chabad etc, at least )Goldman is unlucky that’s became so public…

  • to #96

    If he has sent out a letter, post here so you can shed light on his take of events. With all due respect to Rabbi Goldman, I don’t think he is the Rosh’s equal. The Rosh has an achrayus to the next generation; our bochurim. He sees the “destruction” happening right before our eyes and we are oblivious to it. Shluchim are not infallible. It’s time the Shluchim Kinus bans him from attending and posting all pics over the internet of him rubbing shoulders with our so called leadership.

• Anonymous

  And now the numbers shifted again. What was #48 a few minutes ago is now #49. This is not a very good system for for dialogue when you can’t reference a # because the # keeps changing.

  • Milhouse

    That’s why there’s a reply option under every comment. Use that. Nobody told you to use numbers..

• Rosh is a voice to be heard and followed

  Revered Prominent Venerable – how does one get such titles? By being the RaMaK’s brother in law or by wearing his borsalino tilted???
  The Rosh has every right to not stand by idly like so many do.
  The Rosh is not a politician. So if he does voice his opinion, take heed.

• Mendy Hecht

  One of the several issues here is our own welcoming attitude towards, and embrace of, fellow Jews with non-Torah views and beliefs (or non-beliefs). Let’s remember that our Rebbe himself had people like Yaakov Agam, self-described and unashamed atheists, come by him for Dollars, and the Rebbe would smile and engage him. (Also, it was not unusual to have big Reform rabbis and/or anti-religious Israeli leaders by farbrengens or Dollars.)

  I understand that the Rebbe didn’t have any of these men speak to the oilam or farbreng with the bochurim and thus give their views a hechsher, but still, I think that part of what is happening here is that we are equating the tolerance that is Ahavas Yisroel as we do it in Lubavitch with giving these non-Kosher views a public forum.

  In other words, some of us may be thinking that to reject Shmuely Boteach from speaking is to reject another Jew, which is something we in Chabad don’t do. But they’re not the same.

• moishe - to # 50

  I’m sorry for you, it’s a real nebech on you you and the others you asked, you have no hasagah what learning is if you if you haven’t heard of the ROSH and heard his maarochos. How about inviting him for a shiur and shmuess in learning?!

  • If the Rosh would be in Litvish World...

    If the Rosh would be in Litvish World…they would bow to him after attaching him to a crucifix.

  • New book: Kosher Rosh

    If the Litvish crucify the Rosh and make him their getchkeh, then Boteach will write a new book: Kosher Rosh.

  • צלם דמות אדם רשע

    Please remove the picture of the menuval S. Boteach:
    אסור לאדם להסתכל בצלם דמות אדם רשע

    Key word is צלם, as in “Kosher צלם”

• BOTEACH PLAN

  He is planning a response. He will do his usual law suit thing. I can’t wait. We will bury him.

  • the Rebbe must be very proud of you!

    you wrote:
    “I can’t wait. We will bury him”

    really?!
    is this hate the focus the Rebbe wanted you and the Rosh to use to bring moshiach?

    this focus on bashing and highliting the negitive in other yidden, is the polar opposite of the Rebbe’s will and entire focus in how to spread light and prepare the world for Geulah!

    hate and this promotion of sina is purely from sitra achara, deceptively disguised in holly garb, to influence the feeble minded and those who have a craving to bash others to feel good about themselves

    Hashem Yerachem!

• Time to close down COL altogether

  COL is the worst form of journalism, ever. They have ZERO credibility because they allow the most vicious, stupid, wrong posts…so long as they don’t offend COL or their friends…

• Thank you

  The Rosh was lauded for his participation in the COTS escapades of just two months ago. What he is doing now is the same, and I thank him.
  COTS was also attended and promoted by shluchim. Where was and where is Moshe Kotlarsky who needs to take responsibility for these wayward shluchim?

• Sam sapojnik

  כולנו חמורים! חמרא בתמוז קרירא ליה, טמטום הלב והמח! !!!אוי רבי !העלף מיר שוין

  דעם עיקר איז קב”ע that’s everyone knows that’s The יסוד
  And that’s what will bring everything else לימוד,אמונת חכמים ,התקשרות וכו’
  בברכת חסידים לבבית:
  מרבים בשמחה במשמעות וקב “ע

• Rivkah

  Sometimes Rabbi Boteach’s Facebook updates are so inappropriate I ask him if his account got hacked.

  • בוחר'ל

    גוט געזאגט

• J Bieber

  What happens in SA stays in SA…

• Confused - Cape Town too?

  Why is no one mentioning that he is also set to speak at the Marais Rd Shul in Cape Town where Rabbi Dovid Wineberg is the Rav?

• Re: Cape Town - Dor haShmuli!

  Oy, mai haya lonu! Rosh is so right! Before you know it will “coming to the shul next door to you”… Where is Merkoz? Where are all these Rabbis when they are truly needed? Kotlyarsky, Krinsky, Shemtov and others? I understand, that it’s not as exciting as to condemn “mashichisten”, but perhaps it’s something that is actually desperately needed.

• Pops

  Boteach’s response:

  http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Columnists/No-holds-barred-Chabad-fanatics-are-destroying-the-movement-342425

• Dr. Cliff

  Is it considered Jewish, halacha’dik, to inquire ..
  “What are the authentic MEANINGS & DETAILS of and behind Proclamations?”

  I would think, DEFINITELY so! Do you think I’m wrong? Simply recall Passover, the seder questions by All. I ask you, what is the Meaning of Questions?

  Personally I’m in favor of highest, most meaningful proclamations .. that is, those are, by the Lubavitcher Rebbe.

  P.S. These days many people do read .. TITLES of books .. rather than their actual pages too ..

  For example, I have a book which few other than me have actually read, yet. Not even my mother, although we’re working on it. :-)

• Sholem Bacher, Shliach, Randburg, South Africa

  Re: Rabbi Yossy Goldman
  With all the talk of ‘Kosher this’ and ‘Kosher that’ perhaps we all need a reminder that even a Mecho-ah, has to be Kosher. ‘Shliach Bashing’ is not Kosher, nor is Character assassination or full on defamation. Why did the Rebbe remind us so many times about Ahavas Yisroel on a seemingly basic level! Surely to remind us that Ahavas Yisroel is not a protocol reserved for ‘Mekurovim’ and strangers. Perhaps to highlight the Nisayon we experience when we decide to reprimand our brothers and sisters, fellow Shluchim and Anash, without sensitivity or care.
  Rabbi Goldman is a shliach that has contributed immensely, on many levels, over many years, to the Hatzlocha of Lubavitch in South Africa. He has always been willing to lend an ear to assist fellow shluchim. Our Mosdos, our schools, our Chabad houses, and countless Baale Batim have been beneficiaries of his concern and dedication over many years. For those of us who know Rabbi Goldman and the true state of his Shlichus it is deeply painful to read the comments that have been made.
  Whatever strong feelings may have arisen regarding the suitability of a particular speaker or the terminology that was used to promote the event. The style and manner of this attack on Rabbi Goldman is unjust and contradictory to what we stand for as Chassidim.
  Moreover, our very unique body of Shluchim and the Hanholah here in South Africa are quite capable of resolving issues that arise in a constructive way. There is a capacity amongst our Shluchim here, beyond many other places, to behave in a manner of Ahavas Achim, V’Ahavas Yisroel. As such, those who truly desire a Kiddush Shem Lubavitch here in South Africa or anywhere, should allow the local Shluchim to deal with our own matters.
  Notwithstanding the dissenting opinions on the event that took place. I am confident that I talk on behalf of the Shluchim here in SA in expressing that Rabbi Yossy Goldman remains admired and respected by his fellow Shluchim here in South Africa.

  Sholem Bacher
  Shliach in Randburg, South Africa

  • Bacher who?

    Who are you to question the Rosh??!!! Rabbi Goldman may have helped immensely all moisdes in S.A. But that doesn’t detract from erring in promoting an individual who is hepech Torah and Halacha.
    If you have an issue with the Rosh, did you call him to discuss? Or did you just do what you abhorred others for doing against Rabbi Goldman?
    Your unique body are NOT quite capable of resolving all issues, as they have demonstrated in the past. The Rosh represents Torah, Halacha and Emes. So address the issue the Rosh has. A fire is burning in Lubavitch. Don’t tell other Chassidim to look the other way and ignore. The Rebbe’s koved means nothing to you????
    Boteach may be an amazing talent but he is an aberration. And Shluchim should not be giving him a platform to spread his apikurses.

• just saying

  I think this is a powerful comment on this situation… bc Boteach gives Chabad a bad name by claiming he is a rep of the rebbe and promoting Jesus. Is Chabad bad? No. But most shomer shabbos chareidim dont want to have anything to do with it (unless they’re traveling to some far out place and need kosher).

  S. BOTEACH WAS EXCOMMUNICATED AS A SHLIACH MANY YEARS AGO BY RABBI NACHMAN TZUDAK, WHILE HE WAS STILL AT OXFORD UNIVERSITY. BOTEACH HAS NO PROBLEMS KISSING OTHER WOMEN WHO ARE TOTALLY UNRELATED TO HIM, THIS IS SOMETHING I HAVE WITNESSED WITH MY OWN EYES. FOR A SHLIACH TO GIVE HIM THIS HONOR IS EXACTLY AS THE ROSH PUT IT. RABBI GOLDMAN SHOULD MAYBE STEP DOWN HIMSELF IF HE ALREADY FORGOT WHO SENT HIM THERE, AND SUSTAINED HIM ALL THESE YEARS. HE SHOULD HIDE HIS FACE IN SHAME!!!!!!!!

• handsome

  I think Rabbi Shmuly should make a collection of all these comments and make a book called kosher stupidity.

  Find something better to do with you time and energy rather than clucking at each other like a bunch of irate chickens.

• also a shliach in s.a.

  Protest! SHoLeM don’t dare to talk on behalf All shluchim in s.a. !! All your taines are ridiculous, absurd and bathetic ! Kabel haEmes mimisheomra! Just put your farkakte koved aside, read carefully what others wrote and don’t make from Rosh a clown! Kol hapoisel beMumo poisel, open your eyes, do tshuva du bizt a chticha shenaasis… and if not -hikoved vesheiv bebeischo! Stop bringing us ale gute zachen that Goldman vekayoitze DID, al taamin beatzmach..
  i Don’t want to identified myself like you, vehameivin yovin.

  • I respect Rabbi Bacher for putting his name on his very sensible comments

    anonymity??!

    anyone anonymous commenter can claim to be a shliach in s.a

    post your name if your legit.. and not just a hate mongerer

• hot headed hate targeting fellow jews... is exactly what causes chilul lubavitch

  there are thousands of more peaceful and (considerate) ohev-shalomdige ways “those concerned” could have approached this issue!

  why did the Rosh rush to indulge in this public display of putting others down, before attempting to reach out to Rabbi Goldman, or to a Rav moreh horaah, to analyze the details, (beyond the hysteria) to decide whether this is the appropriate “Ohev Shalom” way to resolve concerns and promote shalom in our community!

  comments echoing the Rosh’s tone, are shocking, “berry him”?!!! is that really the language of a chossid of the Rebbe?
  is this the language of an Ohev yisroel??
  is this the language and tone of someone seeking to do what Hashem wants?! seeking to spread Ahavas yisroel, and achdus?? seeking to focus on the positive?? seeking to highlight the good??
  seeking to focus on what unites us vs what divides us?
  i sincerely hope that the Relatives (family members) of the Rosh who are anonymously trying to defend and justify his negative focus and derech, of bitterness anger and attacking/shaming fellow yidden borabim, i hope these (rosh) defenders realize that this is not the right way! this brings very little good to our community! this brings the opposite of Kidush Lubavitch!, and instead gives a big thrill to the sitra achara!

  may the 1000s of sensible Rabbonim in chabad who chose to not engage in such (hate) rhetoric be commended for using discretion and judgement in a way that spares our community this kind of fruitless (counter-productive) negativity

• I think

  this site should use more discretion in what they post!
  I’m no fan of SB ( quite the opposite) but I’m no fan
  of chilul Lubavitch either. Nuf said.

• Sad for Chabad

  So in the past little while: COTS is Kefirah. SB is banned. Who is Chabad gonna ban next??? Who are Chabad rabbonim going to declare hepich hatorah. This is getting pathetic.

• Chassid

  To # 147:

  Rabbonim from both inside and outside Chabad paskened that COTS is against halacha. Many more Rabbonim from inside and outside of Chabad paskened that SB is saying things which are against halacha, It is a very sad day for Chabad and pathetic that there are those that cannot accept the authority of Rabbonim to decide the Halacha.

• 99.9% of Rabbonim morei horaah, dont subscribe to this "hate-mongering" form of rheteric... BH! there are far more rsponsible and proffessional cool headed ways to discuss issues privately behind closed doors, with the Rabbis involved, instead of this rec

  comments echoing the Rosh’s tone, are shocking, “berry him”?!!! is that really the language of a chossid of the Rebbe?
  is this the language of an Ohev yisroel??
  is this the language and tone of someone seeking to do what Hashem wants?! seeking to spread Ahavas yisroel, and achdus?? seeking to focus on the positive?? seeking to highlight the good??
  seeking to focus on what unites us vs what divides us?
  i sincerely hope that the Relatives (family members) of the Rosh who are anonymously trying to defend and justify his negative focus and derech, of bitterness anger and attacking/shaming fellow yidden borabim, i hope these (rosh) defenders realize that this is not the right way! this brings very little good to our community! this brings the opposite of Kidush Lubavitch!, and instead gives a big thrill to the sitra achara!

  may the 1000s of sensible Rabbonim in chabad who chose to not engage in such (hate) rhetoric be commended for using discretion and judgement in a way that spares our community this kind of fruitless (counter-productive) negativity

• Jason

  Boteach is not a Chilul Hashem, He is a Kiddush Hashem, He makes the Goyim think that the Torah is Not Mamosh Racist and Sexist Against Woman , He makes the world think that Judaism has What to Offer.

• Happy for Chabad

  So in the past we go COTS. SB is rampant. Who is Chabad gonna be next??? Who are Chabad rabbonim going to declare derech hatorah. This is getting pathetic.

• ab

  the Rosh is one of ours, what is this that we refute one of our own Chabad leaders? Because its yemot hamoshiach?
  and
  do we say ok to everyone who comes around? Is that respect to Chabad Rabbeim, to the Rebbe?
  Do we lower our standards in kashrus too? Whats the difference……

  • Dr. Cliff

    Re. “They, like the rest of our generation, have very serious issues..”
    ~
    Which issues?
    – – –

• Interact

  Having interacted with both Shmully B. and Ezra S. I feel that it is improper to attack either. They, like the rest of our generation have very serious issues which are only made more unstable by comments like I have read here. Mental and emotional pain and anguish is much more painful than physical pain. Pray that HaShem make them and all of us, Klall Yisrael, healthy, mentally, emotionally and physically, so that we can all together fulfill our Shlichut.

  • unfortunately you are right

    i have met both on several ocassions, they each (the Rosh and RSB) have personal internal issues they are struggeling with and need to sort out, in a proper setting, Not on the public stage at the expense of Sholom and Ahavas yisroel in our community.

    Most machlokis usually stems from two individuals with pesonal baggage!

    is the Rosh a Gadol in Learning? yes! is RSB a world class academic? yes!
    are they both suffering? yes! are they both not in line with the Rebbe’s derech? yes! unfortunately!

    one uses provocative language th other uses Machlokis to get his kix

    each lost focus of the Rebbe’s Tzav Hashaah!

    no amount of justification can legitimize, rushing to display negativity against another jew (by name) in public, especially when other options need to be tried first!

    civil options! which show discretion for the sake of the public and shalom!

• Rabbi's need Rabbis too!

  Who did the Rosh consult before rushing to produce this inflammatory document shaming another jew?

  did he consult a Rav Moreh Horaah?

  did a Rov pasken that the Rosh rush to the streets (not S.A streets even, because it was Shabbos!) did the Rosh get a heter to instead of a phone respectful call to Rabbi G. to go take his hate public?! to a public not even in S.A.?!

  smells like sinaa! i wish i was wrong!

• Dr. Cliff

  Jews are anti-Authoritarian by nature… Specifics? Note Purim, celebrating Mordecai’s refusal to bow down to Haman, and the story of Jewish survival despite an autocratic decree to (try to) destroy them.

  Sound familiar? Judaism prays to the One Above, and does not idolize nor pray to Those Below.

  Mathematical Formula about an old problem:
  -What is an “anti-Semite”?-

  Assuming Semites, Semitism means Jews & Judaism,
  and now let’s replace ‘Semites’ with
  ‘anti-Authoritarians.’

  Therefore,
  “anti-Semites = anti-anti-Authoritarians
  =s pro-Authoritarians!”

  And isn’t this true .. are not anti-Semites typically or always Authoritarian personalities?

  Those who are in a Cold war or Hot war with their own Essence, may wish to annihilate it in themselves, and in others too. Fortunately that’s not possible, no joke, but many do seem to try.

• Traditional orthodox Cape Town

  You rabonnim should be ashamed of yourself. Its embarassing

  You have put your techicalities and your petty politics before derech eretz, and before treating people as you would be treated.

  Be kind to your fellow Jews and go from there.

  You should be examples to us all, but you are failing miserably

  You put me off becoming more religeous…but i would never slander fellow Jews on a public platform.

  Enough with the technical nonsense…more humility please