50 Comments

• dg

  this got to stop. i think one to do it is a united effort for parents to resolve to leave their girls in the local seminarry. ect.

• shmuel Y

  it is too bad that no one is really listening. we are setting ourselves up for disaster with the high cost of tuition. small families, home schools, and eventually public schools are not so far fetched. as for seminary….. state collage is sounding cheaper and unfortunately an option in some homes and that is only the start as more and more of the better girls will start going as it becomes more and more acceptable.

• anonymous

  I am going through that system now and it is kinda ridiculous. Most seminaries in Israel raised the price $1000 because the American Dollor went down.

• David

  Very nice, but imagine how this makes his daughter feel…..

• father of sem student

  This hat can be bought by anyone at the gift shops in Tzfas for 50 shekel, almost the price of a borsalino….

• sara

  What is the question? The teachers at the seminary have to be paid, room and board costs something. Not all the girls get to go to seminary; mine didn’t.

• Aliyah

  Instead of complaining about the high cost of tuition for seminaries and yeshivot, just pack up and move to Israel. I’m serious and I’m doing it next year I”YH. If you are not tied down in the US it is a very practical option.

  Yes, I know there will be plenty of financial hardship but at least I won’t feel resentment towards Jewish institutions. I’d rather struggle to pay the rent than struggle to pay for Jewish education. It’s much easier to swallow.

• TRS

  This message-on-a-hat, along with many other insightful and humorous messages, can be purchased at Jerusalem Yarmulka in Meah Shaarim for a nominal fee.

• dtw

  It used to be thought that sem attendance would make a girl more marriageable or more employable and this is becoming less and less the case. It would seem cheaper to use local sems such as Bais Rivka or skip sem and get some teacher’s training. Today the frum schools require certified teachers. Sending teenagers far away from home might also allow them to utilize their “freedom” in the wrong ways. Ben Yehudah Street is full of American sem students on Motzei Shabbosim and they are looking for fun that they could not have at home. I say that educators should re-think sem. After a year or 2 of sem and a year or 2 of shlichus, the average girl has an earning capacity of under $15 per hour. They enter marriage unable to make enough for rent if their husbands are in kollel.
  The $15,000 can be money well spent if girls get a sense of direction in sem but often that money would have gone farther if the girls had attended a half day of local sem and spent the other half on earning a teaching certificate from a frum facility or working. As far as the EY experience, there are kosher trips for girls during the summer.

• beenthere

  that statement will make the daughter feel guitly and can be severly determental to her..mabe a punch line aiming more at the schools should do it..

• Loosing focus

  If instead of supporting global funtions, we supported our own schools and educational institutions, we would not be stuck with this problem. Instead everyones busy giving money everywhere else besides our own, while at the same time expecting the best teachers, but paying them like janitors. Parents suffer over the high costs their expected to pay. BH chabad has enough money inside to solve these problems on our own. Instead its turned into a vicious vicious cycle.

• ha ha

  its called a joke, not a protest!!!

• OUT OF TOWNER

  Seminary is really optional and many girls are raised knowing its not an option,
  But school tuition is a freakin fortune and not an option! Living on shlichus out of town and sending children to chabad schools if we are fortunate enough to have then in a drives distance is extremly expensive forget the price of gas or having to send children o ut of town and paying boarding fees on top of tuition is really unaffordable.
  I am hope I am wrong but look at young families today, the large double didigt families are becoming less and less heard of!
  Might tuition be playing a role?

• Chana

  HA! must be my father your talking about wearing the cap that my sister got him.

• Tachlis

  With several fine seminaries in North America at a much lower cost, why do we feel we MUST send our daughters to Eretz Yisroel? (And please don’t answer something stupid like it’s for shidduchim).

• Chaim

  I cant afford to buy kosher food anymore because i send my kids to yeshiva!!!

• sem

  im going to wem next year and am so worried about how my parents who are shluchim will afford

• unsympathetic parent

  I have no doubt that running is sem is an expensive exercise and wilth the fall of he american dollar the seminaries had no choice but to raise their fees.
  I do doubt however if sem is value for money.
  The sems are so selective in their acceptances that only the best get into the 3 top sems. So we have good girls who enter and good girls who exit, and nothing to show for my $15,000. Sure they girls have a great time while the parensts slave away or do without is that the proper chinuch we want to give our girls as preparatration for Kollel life “pas b’melech toychal”??
  For American shluchim and baalei baatim there is a much cheaper option of sendig the girls to the different local sems (who benches are depleted) Tuition is cheaper, airfare is cheaper and very little of the touring and traveling expenses. Why don’t we ensure that the local seminaries are a viable
  option.
  I also once wore Borsalino and when I could no longer afford them did I ask for a price reduction or did I change brands?

• reply to sara

  You wrote whats the Q?
  well yes it does cost something for room and board, food paying teachers etc.. but not so much that it costs 15 thousand per girl, most of the money goes into private pockets, sem became a huge money making buisness.

• No more school

  My kids are staying home this year.We had a choice, eat and have a roof over our heads or pay tuition and lose our house. Oh well, they’ll survive.

• same applies to yeshivas

  the prices mesivtas and yeshivas are charging are outrageous! 15 thousand dollars seems to be the minimum, one yeshiva is charging 18 thousand!!!And this is not even an optional thing or a one year deal, mesivta is three years,where are we supposed to come up with the money for 3 years?! and this is only one child! what about the rest of them?
  I know many fine lubavitch boys who are forced to attend misnagdish yeshivas because their parents are not shluchim or have yichus and connections and the yeshivas won’t give them any sort of discount that shluchim normally get.the litvish yeshivas charge much less, or have scholarships and they don’t base it on who the boys parents are, its based on the middos and fine character of the boy himself.

• Chu

  The simple solution is….

  Don’t send your daughter to sem in Eretz Yisroel!!!

  It’s not a requirement, just because everyone else does it. Guess what, big bar mitzvahs and weddings aren’t a requirement either. Two months in camp aren’t a requirement either. Frum families pay through the nose because they somehow have the idea that everyone must have what everyone else has regardless of the cost or actual utility.

  Your daughter will get married like everyone else and will get a job like everyone else whether or not she gets that indispensible year in EY. How many girls even appreciate the sacrifice their parents make to send them away for that year? How many girls gain commensurate with what their parents pay?

• That cap looks familiar

  Cute! Acutally, My uncle sells those caps at the edge of Geulah / Meah Sheorim! There’s lotsa funny caps there!!

• broke in ch

  Y do you talk about only seminaries

  A “fine” Yeshiva not a million miles from ch won’t send bochrim on Shlichus if parents owe even a couple of thousand in tuition. How do i Know? I got such a letter! We are struggling to pay every penny but were getting there. We have other kids t pay for also!

  wonder what the Rebbe would say about that? Its not sem in EY its yeshiva and shlichus.

• h man

  i have a suprise for everyone here

  being honest and telling your daughter that you just cant afford the tuition and that she has to accept to go to a local sem or work to save money or even not go at all b/c you are unwilling to be like the neighbours and follow whateveryone else does and refuse to get into debt and to have to start borrowing and not pay back money is a MUCH bigger lesson for your kids than anything they will ever learn in any sem

  its the lesson or ehrlichkeit

  it will teach them pride, honesty, living in their means, not to just follow what everyone else does b/c its cool or in fashion

  this is a lesson that is not being taught and is the root cause of many problems

• Fed Up.... Yet Again!!

  Let’s do the math. Your average Lubavitch family has between 6 – 10 kids, so we’ll say 8, split evenly between boys and girls. Forgetting about the 8 years of elementary school, which is getting more expensive by the year, there are 7 years of yeshiva for the boys (plus shlichus, smicha, and 770) and 4 years of high school and a year (or 2) of sem for the girls.

  Your average mesivta / zal charges about $12,000 after whatever discounts they supposedly give out. 7 years times $12,000 is $84,000 a head, which is $336,000 for 4 kids. The girls are paying less for high school, so let’s say $6,000 ( a little low, but we’ll go with this for now) times 4 years times 4 girls, which is another $96,000. Then a year of sem for each, which is $60,000.

  After everything, your average family pays $492,000 in tuition. All this when their children are between the ages of 14 and 22. Your average American makes $35,000 per year (before taxes). That means that this tuition is the equivalent of 14 years of every family’s income, without eating or paying any bills. To top it all off, after you’re done paying all this tuition, you have to marry them off. And let’s not forget the cholov yisroel milk!

  Is it just me, or is it ironic that many of the youth are drifting away from yidishkeit (never mind chassidshkeit)? To me, this says that you just spent close to $500,000 – yes, that’s half of $1M – on some pretty crappy education.

  Yes, I know I didn’t offer any solutions. That’s because I’m 22, left the system, and moved across the country where I can afford to eat. I’m done with this waste of time, and so are most of my friends and the other young people in our community (if you can even call it that). So if you’re reading this, stop wasting your time and reevaluate your lives.

• Concerned Chabad Product of the System

  A. Seminary is NOT optional. A Chabad woman’s whole outlook on life and the spirit with which she imbues in her home is taught in sem. It is an opportunity to REALLY learn before these girls will be burdened with life and all its responsibilities.
  B. Going to a sem out of town with outrageous prices is optional. Most sems are the same. Chassidus is amazing no matter where you learn it.
  C. The financial reality is an issue, but it should not be at the expense of sem. There are many places to get accredited for sem and places to complete your degree without forfeiting building a solid foundation in life.
  D. I think that Chabad as a whole should rethink the system we live in and try and understand how to have an average that will manage financially.
  A way to get Kosher education that can bring in money. Its ridiculous that so many people are struggling to “survive”, it’s not healthy.

• went to sem

  if you think that sem is $15,000 – add the tickets to sem and home for pesach… besides spending money.. and all the clothes before … more like $20,000!

• shluchim out of the country

  We were very worried how we will pay $15,500.00 for our daughter to attend sem in Israel. We then spent hours filling in Masa grant forms and American MJI forms, Now B’H been told we will be getting over 10 thousand between both grants. This will not be the same sending a bochor to yeshiva in america!

• To Concerned Chabad Product of the Syste

  My assumption is that you have no financial responsibility, or possibly just starting a family. Average salaries are probably + -50K per annum. Average means most people are earning that kind of salary even with an education. So I am not sure what you are suggesting. If you have a way for everyone to make 100’s of thousands of dollars to work through the chabad school system then that’s great otherwise remember everyone is earning normal salaries.

  The reason averasge families survive is because they don’t eat kosher, they send their kids to public school etc. Private schools do cost upwards of 10K.

  In regards to your first point. If seminary is the thing that gives a chabad women her outlook and spirit. They whart happened to all the years prior to sem. Maybe the parents should stop sending their kids to school and only seminary. Or maybe they have good haskafa from before and they don’t need sem. Remember it is usually only the good girls who get into the good seminaries.

• annoyed resident

  I did not go to a sem in Isreal and i am glad i didn’t. I did not expect my parents to pay for something so unnecessary. I am happily married and I learned A LOT from the sem i went to(It wasn’t BR). I had a better experience and earned new friends, college credits and lots of job experiences. Isreal is a waste of money, time and believe me, most of my friends came back worse off than when they went. The girls that come back good would be good girls no matter where they went and going to sem is just to have more time with thier so called friends and to be part of the group. Parents do not have to pay for something so not necessary. Girls do not have to go running where everyone else is. Think for yourselves. Who are u trying to copy? noone. just be you and do what is best for you and your family to be happy and live a normal life. As for regular tuition..it is INSANE. I will soon have to pay for my kids and I am so scared and also sick of the whole corrupt system mostly run by people who should NOT be there. The community is really lacking so much and yes, all of us”young” ones are sick of it and do let a lot of our chinuch and learning just go because we see the corruption. At least me and most of my friends just didn’t care and married working men and live how we want When people look down, they should look into themselves because it is them that made it that way. so sad. It is sad that many stray too far and there is such a sad, poor feeling in general for most people around here. I just hope my kids have some sort of brigher future. Please help us young ones to hope for that. Something must b done! Maybe we should start a new community with normal priced housing, food and schooling. Oh, and I make 40 dollars an hour and that is without some fancy seminary and I am all for my kids going to a frum college because what future does this community have for them. You can’t afford housing, food or schools unless your parents, grandparents and great grandparents have millions. it’s all ridiculous!!!!!!!!!!

• whats happening with us?

  what is it with all the kids going to ‘frum’ colleges now?
  what is it with OUR schools only hiring accredited teachers?
  The Rebbe was aware of all of this and was still against college.
  Now that he is physically not with us, did everything he wanted of us change?
  (we wont even go into the lack of beard and tznius issue the last 14 years)

• semgirl

  ha this is the hat the everyone has been buying their fathers as a gift when they came home from seminary for ages, i dont think it is a statement…
  yes, seminary may cost a lot of money, but as someone who just spent the previous year in seminary i can say that is it worth it

• T.

  There are some who can afford a filet mignon for dinner, and there are others who can afford a grilled chicken. The latter is not any less nourishing. Similarly, there are those who can afford to send their daughters to Israel for a year, and there are those who can afford to send them to local seminaries, and there is nothing wrong with that. And as parents, we are often pressured to do things out of guilt. Daughters should be aware of parents’ financial situation and be more understanding as well.

• idea

  teachers should get a degree and go teach in public schools and then parents should send their kids their and after school give them a yidishe education but even in public schools the kids will get somewhat of a yidishe education.this way parents doent have to worry about paying tution and then can pay for the kids to go to seminary etc.

• me@you.com

  btw, non lubavitch sems are twice the price

• Esther

  Thirty years ago, when it was time for me to choose a seminary, I had my heart set on going to Eretz Yisroel as my sister was living there and I really wanted to study there and have the Israel experience. At that time, there was only one seminary there. (BR in Kfar Chabad).I wrote to the Rebbe for a bracha to go to sem in Kfar Chabad, and the Rebbe wrote me back a brocha to go to Bais Rivka in Crown Heights. (I was living in Florida at the time). I was disappointed but went to NY and really enjoyed the learning, fabrengens etc. and had the best two years of my life. Have we forgotten that we are Chassidim of the Rebbe and that we can ask the Rebbe’s guidance on all matters of our lives? Surely, we must do our part to teach all our children to be responsible with money, to do their part to be contributers to the family and not only takers. These are valuable life lessons as they mature into adults and set up their own homes, IY“H. There is no mitzvah to go bankrupt! The Rebbe advised people not to go into debt for the sake of chinuch. Let’s do our part, work hard, as Hashem helps those who helps themselves, cut out the extras and put our trust in Hashem. Then, IY”H with the Rebbe’s brochas we’ll be able to give our children what each one needs-“chinuch lanoar al pi darko!”. Lots of work and lots of emunah!

• dtw

  To what is happening with us:
  What defines a college as a college? Is a frum school that gives college credits so that frum schools can hire the girl to teach, a “college” in the sense that a university is or is it another form of a sem?
  Was the Rebbe opposed to training programs that allowed the person to make a parnassa or to universities that taught alien philosophies such as atheism? If a sem gives college credits, which many do, would the Rebbe have been opposed.
  If a Chabad run day school wants to attract the community, they need certified teachers. One of the biggest complaints about chinuch is lack of teacher training.

• CHT

  How much did it cos him to do custom embroidering? I am sure it was more than Borsalino.

• bocher from O.T.73-----76

  about 15 yrs ago when my boys were still in ocean pky. i asked Rabbi Heller
  if can intervene on my part to lower the $$$$ 4 tuition ,he said in yidish “ wat can i do its problem 4 evry body ”
  i took that msg. and relized i have no choice ,just pay .1 cerdit card 2 3 4 as meny as it takes to get my kids tru yeshiva.hope and pray hashem will help
  i have one more year in the system.
  hey guys . G-d does help

• vifal-der-shiur

  Chu,
  You’re 90% right. However, sending a 11-14 yo to overnight camp is not luxury. It is a necessity to remove them from the summer environment and filth of the streets (esp. in CH, vidal). Sem is optional, especially today when girls are getting married at 21-22, sem is not a make-it-or-break-it for shidduchim that it used to be. Today, people are more interested in what they did after sem, which is far more revealing of the the person’s character than how they were in a one year school.
  The good news is that slowly this reality of shidduchim is seeping into the parents’ decision making and the sems are losing their power and influence.

• sarah

  If you do your research and apply for grants from many local and national Jewish foundations, as well as government grants, you can send your child to Israel for a lot less than the $15,000. My neices got over $8,000 each from grants. It takes legwork, but it can be done.

• Reality

  To add to “Chu”…
  Seminary has become a much bigger deal then it should be. Many girls feel that they HAVE to go to seminary, because “everyone else does.” It’s just one year, and there are alternative options, such as going on shlichus, getting a job, going to school, etc. that will not force families to cut back on other expenses.
  And no, not all girls enjoy their year in seminary, and they don’t always realize what their family had to sacrifice in order to send them to Israel for 10 months! Seminary has become way overrated, and it’s not neccessary for every girl to go (it should not affect your daughter’s shidduch!)

• parant

  i say we stop this entire sem thing give me a brake the teachers there r not to much better then hear and its not fear for the girls who cant affored it and doesnt want to feel diffrent her parants have to pull pannys together to pay i say they should make another prgram in ch for the girls who stay not bais rivkah bc bais rivkah sem is falling apart and they should start a thing that you dont go away for sem what kind of stuped shtick is it 16 000 dollars and then spending money and then you have to fly there come home 4 pasach a sibling gets married all of this could almost = to the same amount as her wedding !!!!!!!!!!!

• not just sem

  its not just seminaries that are charging this outrageous tuitions, some lubavitch high schools in the US are charging $15,000 for tuition not including room and board! what a chutzpah!

• sem beis girl

  i was just in seminary in israel this past yr. i took a picture of the hat to send to my father cuz i couldnt afford to buy one…

• Cry for Help!!! Is anyone listioning???

  I really would like to know what parents are suppose to do. I know this is the question of the day…. But, speaking from personal experience here. How do they expect us to manage?? We are BT’s, our family grew and continued to grow, ka”h when we became frum. Our family size has more than doubled but are income has not increased in the same way. We are now considered at the poverty level. It’s an average American income, but for a family our size, it’s pennies and qualifies us for many government benefits, Thank G-d. But, when it comes to cover costs of tuition how do the schools expect families like ours to cope?? Why can’t the schools do all/most of the fundraising and open it up to all students who want to learn? So those that in all honesty don’t have the money, can attend and learn? Why are we put in this situation to beg, plead, steal(figure of speech) take on debt we can’t handle, ect, ect to get our kids an education? I wish Mr Rohr would understand the situation a lot of families are in. And help make a Lubavitch Chinuch an option to all regardless of ability to pay. Or others like him who value Jewish Education and have the money to make such a difference. Why doesn’t the leadership in CH tackle this??
  I’m sad.

• aussie

  as a pre seminary girl, i would like to comment that you are all complaining but missing the point. firstly, hypocracy comes in when you complain about the education etc but don’t even know how to spell. im particularly addressing this comment to parant… proving your children with a decent secular education might help them become accredited teachers, who will then in turn be able to afford seminary for their children.

  in addition i suggest you research the price for the non chabad seminaries, which many are forced to go to because the chabad ones are so selective. their fees amount to an average of 21 000 per anum. thats more than the cholov yisroel milk that you are also complaining about yet in australia milk costs up to 5 dollars for 2 litres which is much smaller than your galleon.

  and with reference to the comment about beards and tznius, what exactly are you inferring? your children i presume are extremely tznius and have beards kol hakavod to you, but the fact is, masa provides subsidies to those in need, and ausrtalians are not even granted half as much as you, so i don’t understand the need for complaint.

• sem is not negotiable

  ATT aussie
  could u try and refrain urself from makine all australians look like absolute idiots. when u use the title aussie u imply that all australians think the way u do…since i believe ur arguments are positiviely stupid i would rather not be associates with it.

  yes seminaries cost a huge aount, and the strain it puts on many hardworking families is enourmous.
  All that said, i do believe going to seminary- be it local or in eretz yosroel is not negotiable. Forget the actual experience, the learning and guidance one recieves takes them through life and is eesential to building a good frum jewish home.

• suprised

  B”H
  good points in theory aussie, however that is a rash statement to make,as many of us lubavitchers get far in life without the secular education, & many people with a secular education still struggle with the fees…
  ‘sem is not negotiable,’ what you say implies that if sem is ESSENTIAL to a good jewish home, one cannot establish a real one without sem.
  While i agree that sem should be made a priority, & is of extreme importance, IT IS NOT A PRE-REQUISITE for establishing a good chassidish home.