CrownHeightsWatch, a website whose stated mandate is to expose predators in living in Crown Heights, and who first exposed the actions of accused child molester Moshe Keller, released a letter condemning the Vaad Hakohol for ignoring the Beis Dins letter encouraging victims to go to the authorities.
Letter: “It’s Disheartening that the Vaad Is Scaring [Victims] into Silence
CrownHeightsWatch, a website whose stated mandate is to expose predators in living in Crown Heights, and who first exposed the actions of accused child molester Moshe Keller, released a letter condemning the Vaad Hakohol for ignoring the Beis Dins letter encouraging victims to go to the authorities.
Dear Crown Heights Jewish Community Council (CHJCC), Vaad HaKohol and Residents:
Recently the Crown Heights Beis Din issued a Psak Din requiring people to report to the police credible claims of child sexual abuse in the Jewish community. In light of Keller’s recent arrest it is reassuring to see that the community is taking the Beis Din’s mandate seriously. It’s disheartening on the other hand to see the Vaad completely ignore the Beis Din’s mandate by scaring survivors into silence which will assuredly continue to endanger our community.
The presumption of innocence is certainly a sacred cornerstone of our modern democracy, Jewish law and Chazals teaching of dan l’kaf zechus. The presumption of innocence however does not conflict with the right to free speech and obligation to protect the innocent.
Furthermore, when we know information that could save people from being hurt, all rules of lashon harah and rechilus are out the window and to NOT speak is a grave sin of do not stand idly by your brother’s blood. Leviticus 19:16. It is about public safety. Having compassion for molesters by concealing their identities is an act of cruelty that endangers innocent lives. If a doctor purposely failed to isolate a patient with a deadly contagious disease because it was embarrassing to the patient and his family, it would constitute professional negligence, not an act of compassion! Child molestation is a deadly disease and parents need to know whom to keep their children away from.
If a local retailer were caught selling traif, would there be the same reaction to keep quiet and let the courts sort it out? CrownHeightsWatch.com is simply following the obligations of not standing idly by your neighbors blood.
Clinical psychologist Dr. Asher Lipner said it best in an article in the Jewish Press published this year:
The mitzvah to confront child molesters is incumbent upon each of us. As Rabbi Shea Hecht charged at a recent gathering for the National Jewish Week for the Prevention of Child Abuse, when Shimon and Levi held the entire city of Shechem accountable for the rape of Dina by only one of its citizens, it taught us for all time that someone who abuses even one Jewish girl or boy must be confronted by every member of society.
Excuses for not doing so include bogus halachic claims of mesira, lashon hara and chillul Hashem; concern over the “unfair” suffering of the abuser’s innocent family (who are often victims themselves in need of help); and fear of lawsuits against yeshivas that have knowingly harbored molesters. Not one of these makes sense when the physical, emotional and spiritual safety of children is at stake. Psychological studies repeatedly find that molested children are significantly more likely to suffer later in life from depression, anxiety, substance abuse and addictions, posttraumatic stress disorder, sexual and interpersonal problems, and suicide.
If the leaders of our community believe that false rumors are being spread then they should condemn that speech by intelligently responding to those false allegations not trying to quell peoples right to free speech. Do leaders of the community think that their constituents aren’t smart enough to make up their own minds about abuse allegations? Is the answer to force people into silence?
Every single predator listed in the CrownHeightsWatch registry is a serial offender whose crimes have been independently corroborated by many victims or/and whose crimes are a matter of public record. There isn’t a threat of a personal vendetta leading to a false accusation. These individuals are known pedophiles. No one disputes that. In fact, although Moshe Keller is presumed innocent in a court of law, the DA obviously had probable cause to charge him. If someone is a known molester you don’t need to wait for a conviction to inform and protect the community. No one is suggesting that pedophiles get locked up without their crimes being proven beyond a reasonable doubt but when it comes to protecting our children in public we don’t take chances, especially when someone is a known molester.
Those claiming that child sexual abuse awareness generates mass hysteria should look closely at the widely accepted figures that “1 in 4 girls and 1 in 6 boys will have experienced an episode of sexual abuse while younger than 18 years.” (See National Center for Victims of Crime). The American Academy of Child & Adolescent Psychiatry has also concluded that much abuse goes unreported because children are afraid to disclose what happened, and the legal procedure for validating abuse is difficult. Do you really think that the issue is “rumors, halfmemories… [and]… miscommunications” or perhaps a lack of discussion and awareness within the community? Why is the Vaad fostering a climate where victims will be afraid to come forward?
Lastly, a suspect’s family is as innocent as the victim. It is wrong to malign a suspect’s family. Guilt by association is wrong BUT is it right to silence survivors and advocates for fear that a suspect’s family member will feel stigmatized? Shouldn’t we view a suspects family as innocent as anyone else while at the same time encourage survivors to speak out without fear of reprisal?
Bottom Line:
(1) Victims should be encouraged to come forward, without being discredited, disbelieved and hushed by the Vaad.
(2) Protecting the community by exposing the identities of known molesters is saving lives.
(3) We need to act in accordance with the Beis Din’s recent psak to report abuse to the government authorities.
(4) Expose the known offender. When we don’t speak out and expose the offenders we are violating Halacha by standing idly by our neighbors’ blood and putting a stumbling block in front of the blind.Sincerely,
Crown Heights Watch
suggestion
there has to be a middle ground where the way people are exposed is in a way that 1) makes damn sure they did something . 2) is not as explicit in the details of their actions. instead of describing the exact actions they did which to a young reader is disturbing to the clean mind maybe just label them with a title and make it so that its known that if you have such and such title i.e. dirty person, you are ousted for life as person children should stay away from.
margo
The council is full of lying and sheker. If someone violates another person they deserve to pay for it. If it happened to them or their family they would think and act differently. This guy is a curse-get rid of him.
advocate of victim-s rights
Brilliant! Kudos to chwatch!
Yakov
BSD
All the vaad’s letter said was that one should assume Keller’s innocent until proven guilty, which is the basic rule of Pirkei Avos, “dan lekaf z’chus.” It doesn’t say that he shouldn’t have been reported on or that we shouldn’t report abusers to the police. It didn’t say anything close to that. This is clear and obvious to anyone who read the letter.
Whoever wrote this letter is wasting his time and trying to create un-needed machloikes. In addition, he has difficulty comprehending what he reads.
Zevele meishele
read their letter again, the Vaad Hakohol is not ignoring the Beis Din’s letter at all!!!
to #4
well said!! nice to see some intelligent people on this silly site
Who you Bichllal?
The problem with this blog is its anonymous nature, with no accountability to anyone. What’s to stop them posting stories about people they don’t like or not posting about people they do like (there are at least another 5 people that I know of who should be on that list).
What’s to stop a couple of people “anonymously coming forward” to the author of that site and making allegations against an enemy of theirs? Does the alleged perpetrator get a chance to defend themselves?
Perhaps that should be some sort of advisory board made up of respected community activists who can monitor what does and what doesn’t get posted to the “registry of offenders”?
proud resident
the people behind CH watch have nothing to be ashamed of. you should sign your name. 99% of CH stands behind you. as long as you make sure the people you expose are 100% abusing kids. because you could never take it back once the damage is done.
Levi
we have 3 dumb clowns in the vaa’d
Crown heights watch keep up the good work, don’t let no one bring you guys down!! you are every PREDATORS WORST NIGHTMARE !! go after every single one of them and bring them down!!
We crown heights and the jewish people stand behind you! just be careful. The only people that will get in your way and disagree with what you are doing is predators or people that have family that is a predator and friends… so dont worry just fight this war and we will win it
Thank you for standing in the front lines for all of our children
CMA
QUOTE: “The presumption of innocence is certainly a sacred cornerstone of our modern democracy, Jewish law and Chazals teaching of dan l’kaf zechus. The presumption of innocence however does not conflict with the right to free speech and obligation to protect the innocent.”
Uh, yes it does. There’s no such thing as “free speech” in Torah. Since when are you allowed to say whatever you want — even if its 100% true? There are specific rules of loshon horo, motzi shem ra, avak loshon horo, etc. Free speech is very commendable for our nation, but it is not a Torah principle.
You don’t have to agree with the Torah, but don’t misquote it.
me again
shut up you all the letter of the vaad was for other non keller related who have no proof that they did things wrong just some sicko’s having fun at making some more noise.
why dont they expose all their wrongdoings im sure someone has things to say about lets say the shomrim 6
punish the guilty - protect the innocent
I don’t see how the vaad’s letter is scaring victims- It is only saying that we should not put the entire family of the accused into cherum and should not treat the accused as a monster. It is NOT saying that victims should not come forth and accuse the monsters that hurt them. What it is preventing though is another type of monster- The case where Ploni gets upset at personB and decides to ruin his reputation by making up stories about him. and yes this does happen also. It is also preventing the possible issue that the entire family of a monster will be prevented from getting shidduchim, jobs, or renting an apartment because of what the monster did. I have seen a lot of good come out on the internet but certain blogs like to make up motzi shem ra in spite. If ANYONE abuses anyone else they ought to be brought to justice. and the vaad is not denying that. But in a close knit community such as ours we need to protect the innocents also. may we have moshiach now and the end to all this pain.
Just my two cents
I live out-of-town and am not privy to Crown Heights politics.
However, the letter from the Community council does not state any of the things that this article alleges!
You cannot have lynching, you cannot have the law taken into vigilante hands. That is not progress, that is going backwards.
Victims must be taken seriously – molestation destroys the very fabric of an individuals soul and that of society. However, caution must be taken that anger does not turn to vengeance. Benefit of the doubt must be afforded to all. The truth will emerge, but maligning people publicly is not the route to take.
I think the letter from that Vaad was level headed and sensitive to the victims of abuse.
Laaniyas Dayti
To Yakov @ #4
Go learn the halacha with respect to Dan LeKaf Zechus.
There are limitations, and this guy Keller (having done time in Israel) does not qualify.
In fact, in precisely this evil deed, there is a known rule adhered to by professionals: A molester will never be totally cured. (We may add, unless he has some serious & conclusive biological surgery, which is a Lav in the Torah. Perhaps there is reason for exception? Let the “bais din” (free translation: beis din = secondary noisemakers) speak to that.)
There is no Dan LeKaf zechuss due to this perpetrator here.
May I just add, that it is my custom to respond to the Kaf Zechus claim: “Hey, maybe I did, and YOU should be dan ME lekaf zechuss.
I agree with #4
You have a good point. and I think the Vaad’s letter is a necessary letter. Otherwise anyone who wants to discredit his enemy or competition could just start a rumor and have the guy whom he wants to get even with damaged for life.
chatzkel
I agree with every word written, BUT as long as there is no name backing this website, it will be considered by any intelligent person a “pashkevill” and sleezy website…
DS
“EVERY SINGLE PREDATOR LISTED IN THE CROWNHEIGHTSWATCH REGISTRY IS A SERIAL OFFENDER WHOSE CRIMES HAVE BEEN INDEPENDENTLY CORROBORTED BY MANY VICTIMS OR/AND WHOSE CRIMES ARE A MATTER OF PUBLIC RECORD.”
This is the main thing. Everything else is stuff to be dealt with, but this is the MAIN issue – CrownHeightsWatch is simply PROTECTING future victims. It is every single parent’s responsibility to know who and what are the dangers to their children. Imagine if you found out that some kids’ schools bus drivers were unlicensed. Would you feel any obligation to let parents know?
And risk of molestation is as potentially deadly.
Let’s not make all kinds of noise that obscures the main issue – that is the protection of children. And that is exactly what CHW is doing!
to yakov and the vaad!!!
the underlying message of the letter that the vaad put of was protecting and simply concerned with the predator and the predators family… there was sooo concern for the victims… this is the first time that the vaad has ever come out with a letter on this topic, and it is also the first time that a predator has finally been exposed… this is after yrs and yrs of abuse, the letter from the vaad should really have been written to the victims, dont you think???? it should have been an apology for not protecting them, for not educating them and making our youth more aware, for not creating conseqences for the predator, so he would have mayb thought twice before abusing… it should have apologized for all these things.. and it should also apologize to the future victims, because the letter they come out with was simply saying to allow things to stay the way they were… with more concern for the predator then for the victim!!! with such leaders, and letters, we can now assume crown heights has no hope of change!!
I WANT TO SEE AN APOLOGY LETTER FROM THE VAAD TO THE VICTIMS!!
who are you?
who is behind crownheightswatch?!
Born N bread CH-r
ch watch Congrads!!! You just lost my support. The vaad’s letter was %100 true. It did not say not to go to the cops. It spoke about Yentas in CH who love to know everything they don’t. If I know someone one is a M— I should and will report them. If someone tells me that their cousin’s dog’s friend said… that should not make me come to conclusions. CH watch, you are a bunch of idiots exploiting a hot topic to make a name for your self at the cost of others. SHMUKS!!! I can’t believe I actually though you cared!!!
THANK YOU CH WATCH
THANK YOU CH WATCH. I JUST WANT TO TELL YOU THAT I WAS A VICTIM OF ABUSE, GROWING UP, AND THE THING THAT HURTS AND AFFECTED ME THE MOST WASN’T WHAT WAS DONE TO ME, IT WAS BY THE FACT THAT IT WAS DONE BY SOME ONE WHO I LOOKED UP TOO, SOME ONE OLDER THEN ME, SOME ONE WHO WAS MEANT TO CARE FOR AND PROTECT ME. IT WAS THE BETRAYAL THAT KILLED ME. I DONT WANT TO GO INTO THE AFFECTS THAT THIS IS HAD ON MY LIFE, ALTHOUGH I DO WANT TO SAY THAT I WAS SLOWLY RECOVERING AND REGAINING BACK A ‘NORMAL’ LIFE. ALTHOUGH… WHEN I READ THAT LETTER FROM THE THREE VAAD MEMBERS / OR SHOULD I SAY THE THREE COMMUNITY LEADERS, I FELT THAT SAME STAB ALL OVER AGAIN. THESE ARE OUR LEADERS, THEY ARE MEANT TO PROTECT US, (THE INNOCENT ONES). IT REALLY REALLY HURT SO MUCH, TO FEEL THAT NEGLECT, BETRAYEL AND PAIN ALL OVER AGAIN. OUR LEADERS WERE CONCERNED WITH THE MOLESTER AND HIS FAMILY. IN OTHER WORDS; ME, AS A INNOCENT YOUNG GIRL, I COULD HAVE LEAD A NORMAL LIFE, I COULD HAVE ACHIEVED AND BEEN SUCCESSFUL, INSTEAD I WAS SHUT DOWN BY MY ABUSER, AND THEN OUR COMMUNITY LEADERS COME AHEAD AND BASICALLY TELL ME TO GO TO HELL, WITH THEIR IMMENSE CONCERN FOR THE ABUSER. I HAVE NEVER FELT SO ASHAMED TO BE PART OF A FRUM COMMUNITY. I ALWAYS FELT THAT I WAS ABUSED, BUT IF PPL KNEW THEY WOULD BE OUTRAGED, MAD AND THEY WOULD FREAK OUT, INSTEAD WHEN FINALLY FINALLY A ORGANIZATION LIKE CH WATCH DID THE UNTHINKABLE AND TOOK ONE OF THESE ANIMALS FINALLY OFF THE STREETS, THE COMMUNITY LEADERS CAME AND ATTACKED THEM FOR EXPOSING THESE EVIL PPL, AND FROM PROTECTING FUTURE VICTIMS. SHAME ON YOU ZAKI, FISCHEL AND YOSSI… I AM EMBARRASSED TO BE APART OF YOUR COMMUINTY….
Disappointed in CH.info
Tanto and the mask rider come to Crown Heights to save the day. Who is CRownheightdwatch. Without names it can not believed. Maybe the mask rider is B Obama
Mind over emotions
“Every single predator listed in the CrownHeightsWatch registry is a serial offender whose crimes have been independently corroborated”
Are you a detective? Did u talk to anyone other then the accuser ?
yes there should be a website exposing Convicted child molesters
But lets just wait until a court of law convicts.
and until the alleged molester is convicted we should not be “blogging” or writing nasty comments if the accused may just be innocent.
To # 4
Not just “Havai Dan Lechf Zechut” But it’s also say : “Chashdehu V’ Chabdehu” (Suspect him but respect him)
So until proven guilty we should all respect.
On the other hand I can totally understand the victims who kept it Shash for soo long, now talking publicly about it is like therapy for them in a way…
Bob
This response from CH Watch is an overreaction. Sure, the JCC letter was silly in that it asked for people to suspend judgment until there is a conviction. There is absolutely no presumption of innocence mandated in the Torah or US law for people’s perceptions. However, the JCC letter said nothing about silencing victims and telling them not to come forward. If anything, it reaffirmed the BD’s letter telling victims to go to the police and not be bullied away. The JCC letter was intended only to remind people of the ideal of presumption of innocence and to be mindful of the family’s agony, which are fair considerations under the circumstances.
mother
I think that there should be a middle ground. First and foremost the protection of our kids from sick people. And yes, these people are sick. Also kids that are molested will in turn molest others when they grow up. I think that CHWatch is a good thing. However, in order to give it more credibility, you need to state that the information has been verified with the police or court or whomever. And state who or where and what. Just stating that we have proof is not enough. What if I want to get even with someone and put his name out there. If there is only a rumor without verification, we must find a way to keep them away from kids. If it is true, there will be enough proof when you dig enough. When you feel that the school bus driver is drunk you will let the school and other parents know even before he takes a test and will not let your child onto the bus
info
WHO IS CROWNHEIGHTSWATCH???? VERY IMPORTANT TO REVEAL IF THERE ARE NO HIDDEN/OTHER AGENDAS ETC…
thanks
Well said CHW, fight for our children’s lives!
G-d bless you and punish the offenders.
choose life!
Any who had their kid abused would write the same letter as KHW, anyone related or associated with a molester would write the same letter as the KHV.
You pick.
DS
To #7 and #10:
Please read!!! The molester registry of CHW posts ONLY when they have credible disclosure from MORE than one victim. This is entirely to protect children from them. It doesn’t matter who’s behind CHW – what matters is the message. And its message is 100% in order to protect potential victims; it’s based on victims’ disclosure, not on rumors.
Let’s not obscure the issue. Let’s deal with the real issue.
CH-er who care
Kudos! Very well balanced and thought our letter especially in the end where they show a recognition of the danger not to castigate the suspect’s family…. “Lastly, a suspect’s family is as innocent as the victim. It is wrong to malign a suspect’s family. Shouldn’t we view a suspects family as innocent as anyone else while at the same time encourage survivors to speak out without fear of reprisal?”…..
Pashkevil
CH WATCH – put your name out for everyone to see. Just like you put other peoples name out. Why are you afraid to tell everyone who you are? Your website is simply a Pashkevil as long as it is annonymous, and you know what the Rebbe said about Pashkevilen.
re: the Accused Back-Rub case
the Judge determined that that he has no history of abuse to children, nor was he evaluated as a future threat to children!
thus the judge determined that he need not be registered on any sex-offender list! to warn parents!
if a judge found his contact as an aberration, -Not indicative of a future risk to children, (perhaps a stupid laps of judgement coupled with perverse curiosity)
WHY THEN MUST THE PUBLIC BE WARNED AFTER EXPERTS EXAMINED THE CASE>>>!!!
Mom in tears
This needs to be hit from ALL directions:
-Kids need to be educated about their bodies, about whats okay and whats NOT okay to be done to it
-Victims need to step forward to CH Watch or an authority to investigate the potential molester
-There need to be RULES when it comes to adults being alone with kids (for tutoring etc.); needs to be done in a public place or a home where other people are present
Its about time these MONSTERS realize that we are ON to them- and if they mess with our kids, they WILL be held accountable.
Chaim Tovim
The man is arrested and therefore there is no need to talk about it any more. If he is convicted, then he will be in jail. If he is innocent, allow him and his family to move on.
The basic point is that there is no need to gossip about it. He’s arrested, done, over.
Look!
Look. Let’s make something clear and simple: There is a horrible, harmful situation here in our community. It’s not ONLY here, but IT IS HERE! I would think that especially since we are frum, we would not WANT this situation to continue UNDER ANY CONDITIONS. Therefore: We are trying as best as we can to put a complete stop to this abuse and hold ANYONE accountable who has acted as an abuser. Sometimes there will be false allegations, but let’s get the priorities straight! In the end, it the victims of abuse that suffer the most. Please hear that. They suffer for a lifetime, while the abusers DO NOT STOP! A falsely accused person (nedugedacht) will suffer to some extent, of course! If I were to pick between the two, I would have to say I would immediately err ON THE SIDE OF THE VICTIM, but I would NOT publicize an accused person’s name. Then GET THE PROFESSIONALS! I see no valid reason NOT to do so! Find out the best way to go about the problem from those who are formally educated and proven effective for ALL involved in each abuse allegation. You don’t go to a dentist for a stomach ache, and you should not go to a Bais Din, etc. to bring appropriate, fair closure to an abuse issue!
Just so you all know...
There is a massive difference between alerting the public of a certain individual who is a danger to society because of his/her pedophile behavior and just blabbing bad stuff about that individual on a public forum such as this one and personal blogs etc.
The first, as the Rabonim have pointed out is an undisputable must.Only identifying information such as name and other identifying information (not including details of atrocities) is necessary though.
The second is blatant Loshon Hara, Rechilus, Motzie shem rah, etc. and has no place in cyberspace or real time. This includes details of the wrongdoing. If we’ve already stated that the perp is a danger to society, all the intricate details of how is irrelevant, and falls under the category of Loshon Horah, etc.
It’s not just a minhag not to talk Loshon Hara, it’s one of Hashem’s commands. Let’s remember that!!! _ That includes talking badly about the CHJCC members, regardless of whether what they did was right or wrong. I’m not passing any judgement. Just pointing out facts.
THANK YOU!
CHW whoever you are – i dont care- thank you for stepping up to the hard task of protecting our children!
vad should be ashamed!
wow the vad should be emmbaressed and ashamed of themselves for writing a letter as they did! why dont we put one of there kids in the same room as one of the men on “registry of offenders” and see how they feel? how would there wives react?
menachem
BH
BSD
As someone that mentors youth at risk, as does Rabbi Keller, I can say it sometimes happens that when one of these youth asks a favor that goes unfilled by the person kind enough to be a mentor, or the faith of their relationship sours, anger sets in the mind of this youth and there is no telling what harm they can do,,,whether it being physical threats or other…its time to be duhn l’kav zchus
Some pointers
Some pointers from the vaad’s letter to me it looked like it was being pointed all at CHW.
But, we are told to suspend judgment until a full investigation and fair process is conducted, because without a fair process we do not know what really happened. Before the conclusion of a fair process, we can be relying on rumors, half-memories, miscommunications, and (sometimes) even intentional deceit.
An alleged perpetrator may be guilty, but he also may be innocent. The possibility of his innocence is (even if you think small, still) very real. If he is guilty – he will be punished. But, in the event that a suspect is not guilty, does anyone want to be responsible for ruining the life of an innocent man?
In addition, a good deal of speculation and chatter has begun to circulate about members of the community that are based on speculation that may not be backed up by actual evidence.
We add nothing positive by adding fuel to the fire and scream and shout and post all over the internet about this. All that achieves is to hurt innocent family members of the accused.
Until then, let’s be patient and show sympathy for the family. Being part of the rumor mill that generates and passes half-truths will do very real, lasting and deep damage to innocent people here. Let’s prevent that.
they are basically saying that CHW does not have there stories right, and they are starting a rumor mill to hurt people, and the suspect might be not guilty and they will be responsible for it, and they hurting the family members by posting it online. ect….. fishel,zaki. And the other clowns were is your letter supporting the victims to come forward? Why haven’t we seen anything from you guys yet??
Just maybe what they did is the right th
1, If, the general public is unaware of the alleged predator who still has contact with potential victims – by publicizing their name, it has clear benefit by saving future children and teenagers lives from being ruined or put at risk.
2. Furthermore, sometimes it helps more victims to get courage to come forward.
3. Sometimes placing their name in public spaces is the last resort, when nothing was done previously to stop the predator from continuing their perverted activities. This includes shipping them to another country where they will find even more victims because no one knows their history.
If allegations are false, that is terrible to the person they are made against. However, even though I do not know who is behind Crown Heights watch, they substantiate all their claims – as they explain: “either the person is a serial offender whose crimes have been independently corroborated by many victims or/and whose crimes are a matter of public record. There isn’t a threat of a personal vendetta leading to a false accusation. These individuals are known pedophiles.”
It seems obvious to me that they are trying to protect young innocent children from harms way. They have courage to do what they do, and I, as a frum Chabad, mother of young children, highly applaud them and support them.
Maybe they do not share information on who they are, and post anonymously to protect themselves and their families against threats and attacks by those who cannot and will not face the truth. Or those who will try and put an end to what they do. Maybe they are worried people will not take them seriously if they don’t come from well-known family or are relatively young. Who knows?
Just maybe they have good intentions. Maybe they are innocent, like the alleged predator is.
Maybe their goal is to keep the streets safe and protect your children, but that is not good enough for people who are more worried about other pressing matters.
Maybe for once support should be given where it is due and they should be commended for finally doing something about a longstanding problem.
Maybe then the world will be a better and safer place to bring up our children.
A DISAPPOINTED CHASID!
Ch watch si another nameless Pashkeville sight that wants to push its own agenda. The Vaad’s letter never said ignore abuse they simply said innocent until proven guilty & do things properly.As for the so called Beis din letter. It is not a unanimous letter.It is the opinion of one Rav & one wannabe &their opinion is the opposite one of another well known Real Rov & Beis Din.Ch watch won’t print their real names because they know they will be sued etc. for stating their false opinions shmearing the innocent etc.If one has real proof present it to a Real Rov Let the Rov make a decision. That is part of the Rov’s Job other wise the liars & those out for revenge etc. will win out
Arthur
There have been a number of instances where individuals
(and their families) who exposed predators or were vocal in bringing these perverts to justice, have been threatened both physically and verbally.In one instance one of these whistle blowers was nearly killed by bullet shots and this all within frum communities.This,I would assume, is the reason for the anonymity of those behind the CH community watch
To CH
I see everybody is talking about chwatch, and a lot of complaining, but nobody is doing anything about exposing and removing the molesters from the street except them.
If you want to put them out of business, The community should put together a board that has no ties or affiliates with anybody and consist of a respected Rabbi’s, a top psychiatrist who is trained in child molestation etc.. and a detective from the NYPD sex crime unit. If the children of our community see you doing something instead of complaining they might start coming to you. Then our community will start going uphill instead of down.
If the community put together such a board, they most probable would end up merging with chwatch who have the “IN” with our children. (This is the facts on the street as all the kids know who to contact) I don’t anticipate any kid that was molested going to a Rabbi etc….
Chwatch would find the kids, put together the proof and then present it to the board and then it would be the boards responsibility to put the pedophiles away for as long as possible AND have a child psychiatrist help the kids. I would think if chwatch saw the community was legit then it might happen.
P.S. I would love to say my name, however, I have no interest in the flak from all the yanta’s.
It-s not the same
To #43-The Rov is not trained to deal with this , so, no, the Rov’s job should NOT be to make a decision. I know the traditional system is what you say, but this issue is a newly opened one, and new measures have to be taken. It has not worked the way it has been! And because of that, many, many victims have been abused. Their lives will never be the same. One possibility is for the Rov(s) to become educated by TRAINED professionals. I don’t mean just any professional, I mean experts in the field. Maybe THEN a Rov will be more equipped. Maybe.
or
Nobody is trying to scare anybody. You might want to reread it to get the meaning more clearly. I think if people (not just you) want to use energy for the good, you might think about getting a class together, or a group, or request an educational venue from the acceptable sources within the community, or, or……..